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$2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components?
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edrusk
Jun 29, 09 6:28
Post #1 of 26 (704 views)
$2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components?
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I currently ride a 2005 P3 (aluminum) with Ultegra components, carbon hydrotail and Flashpointe 60 wheels. I'm trying to determine where money would be better spent to get lighter (and ultimately faster). Should I keep the frame and upgrade components to get the weight down? How much could I conceivably reduce in weight - I don't know. Alternatively I could change out the frame to a much newer carbon frame and keep my components. Will I recognize any change in weight from the 2 options?
What would you do? I understand the frame choice is extremely personal so I'm not necessarily searching for "what frame should I get", but looking for more guidance from those much more experienced than I.
Thanks for your input!
jackmott
Jun 29, 09 6:32
Post #2 of 26 (698 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [edrusk]
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weight has very little impact on time.
and there aren't many carbon frames more aerodynamic than what you have now.
you could maybe get a P3C frame and pick up a bit of speed.
----
rear wheel
disc ALWAYS
http://www.wheelbuilder.com
if you are poor
front wheel
whatever torodial rim based wheel you want, or an H3. deeper if yer faster shallower if yer slower
tires
-
http://www.biketechreview.com
has crr data, use it
frames
- position trumps aero trumps weight trumps paintjob trumps stiffness
water bottle
between your arms or not at all if its a sprint
swim
get some swim lessons, its cheaper than buying bike speed
train more and HTFU
skavoovie
Jun 29, 09 6:35
Post #3 of 26 (693 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [edrusk]
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If it were me I'd upgrade something other than the frame first. Maybe you could use a powermeter...
Trash Talk
Jun 29, 09 6:51
Post #4 of 26 (671 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [skavoovie]
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Keep the frame. Do you have an aero helmet? A disc wheel? How many miles does your current drivetrain have on it? If less than 1500 I would look in other directions first, and deffo go with Ultegra SL or DA 7800. Forget about 7900, it's too expensive if you only have 2k. Maybe check the classifieds here and get an aero helmet, a disc and hire a coach if you don't have one.
-All You Haters Suck My Balls-
tramirez
Jun 29, 09 6:54
Post #5 of 26 (669 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [edrusk]
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I would keep the P3 and use the money to upgrade the rear wheel, hire a coach, get a new bike fit and a VO2 test.
edrusk
Jun 29, 09 9:29
Post #6 of 26 (621 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [tramirez]
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This is all very good information. I currently have a disc wheel with matching front 4-spoke (tubulars) that I didn't mention in the original post. Have an aero helmet. Powermeter might be a good idea - hadn't thought of that.
So, basically keep the P3 (unless I can find a newer P3C for very reasonable) and focus on the "engine" (my own power). If I have lots of miles on components, consider upgrading those, otherwise leave them as is.
From what I'm hearing, it's more about the aerodynamics than the weight, as a general rule. Am I correct?
jackmott
Jun 29, 09 9:31
Post #7 of 26 (618 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [edrusk]
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yeah, it takes a rather large amount of weight to cost as much time as a slight amount of drag generally.
if you have money to burn, going lighter will save a wee bit of time, but not much.
In Reply To
From what I'm hearing, it's more about the aerodynamics than the weight, as a general rule. Am I correct?
----
rear wheel
disc ALWAYS
http://www.wheelbuilder.com
if you are poor
front wheel
whatever torodial rim based wheel you want, or an H3. deeper if yer faster shallower if yer slower
tires
-
http://www.biketechreview.com
has crr data, use it
frames
- position trumps aero trumps weight trumps paintjob trumps stiffness
water bottle
between your arms or not at all if its a sprint
swim
get some swim lessons, its cheaper than buying bike speed
train more and HTFU
pjs
Jun 29, 09 9:48
Post #8 of 26 (590 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [edrusk]
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In reply to
]
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Like others said, the set-up you have now is great. Perhaps use the money to travel to a cool race destination? Fun experiences will always outweigh more gear.
DrPete
Jun 29, 09 9:56
Post #9 of 26 (577 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [edrusk]
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In reply to
]
Can't Post
In Reply To
I currently ride a 2005 P3 (aluminum) with Ultegra components, carbon hydrotail and Flashpointe 60 wheels. I'm trying to determine where money would be better spent to get lighter (and ultimately faster). Should I keep the frame and upgrade components to get the weight down? How much could I conceivably reduce in weight - I don't know. Alternatively I could change out the frame to a much newer carbon frame and keep my components. Will I recognize any change in weight from the 2 options?
What would you do? I understand the frame choice is extremely personal so I'm not necessarily searching for "what frame should I get", but looking for more guidance from those much more experienced than I.
Thanks for your input!
Powermeter and a good training plan.
remnfa
Jun 29, 09 10:32
Post #10 of 26 (548 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [edrusk]
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Powermeter.
tramirez
Jun 29, 09 12:34
Post #11 of 26 (495 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [edrusk]
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Aerodynamics are the most important thing and remember, the least aerodynamic thing on a bike is the rider. If you were fitted to the bike a few years ago, it might be time for another fitting.
Herbert
Jun 29, 09 13:08
Post #12 of 26 (469 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [edrusk]
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Now Ed, if you send me the $2000 you'll go faster because your wallet is so much lighter. :-)
But yes, Powermeter.
xtrpickels
Jun 29, 09 14:57
Post #13 of 26 (420 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [tramirez]
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In Reply To
Aerodynamics are the most important thing and remember, the least aerodynamic thing on a bike is the rider. If you were fitted to the bike a few years ago, it might be time for another fitting.
Exactly, which may lead to a different frame. Buying a frame only for the sake of buying a frame is a great way to waste money.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lactate Threshold Testing- Adirondack Medical Center- Lake Placid, NY
PM me if you would like information
www.amccares.org
edrusk
Jun 29, 09 15:04
Post #14 of 26 (418 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [Herbert]
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In Reply To
Now Ed, if you send me the $2000 you'll go faster because your wallet is so much lighter. :-)
But yes, Powermeter.
Nice one, Herbert! I can always rely on you...
edrusk
Jun 29, 09 15:07
Post #15 of 26 (411 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [edrusk]
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One interesting point that was brought up, that I considered earlier today, is the last time I was fitted was over a year ago and I've lost even more weight, gained more flexability and gotten stronger since that time. I've got an updated fitting scheduled for Thursday. We'll go from there.
Herbert:
keep standing by the post office box for the $2,000 - if it doesn't come soon, just keep waiting there. :-)
(This post was
edited
by edrusk on Jun 29, 09 15:08)
JollyRogers
Jun 29, 09 15:48
Post #16 of 26 (386 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [edrusk]
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Power Meter or Road Bike
edrusk
Jul 3, 09 15:36
Post #17 of 26 (317 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [JollyRogers]
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Got my bike refit last night by a professional: Simril Multisport Coaching - and he made several changes.
Took my seat stub on my P3SL and reversed it, making my seat more forward. Inserted a wedge in my left cleat to make my left knee upright. Took my stem an dropped it all the way. The result of all this, after looking at the photos, this gives me a much more aero position without losing any power. A few slight more changes may happen, but after riding this morning, it felt more aero, felt like I had power when I needed it and I didn't have any back issues from the more aggressive position. The only thing I noticed was my neck and shoulders were getting sore from looking up more than I previously had to - due to the lower position.
Anyone else have this issue? How can I get my neck and shoulders used to this position? Keep riding? Are there stretches I can do or something else?
JollyRogers
Jul 3, 09 18:47
Post #18 of 26 (278 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [edrusk]
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]
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It's pretty much all about adaptation to get your head/neck more used to the position. Just keep riding.
Weights, specifically one of those nautilus machines that works neck flexion, MAY help a bit, but really, it's all about riding and getting your body to adapt.
I had similar issues when I got my first tri bike after several years on a road bike.
jackmott
Jul 3, 09 18:49
Post #19 of 26 (276 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [edrusk]
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]
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congrats!
you can get used to the neck issue
you can also get sunglasses that dont obstruct your vision, so you don't have to look up quite as much (if that is currently an issue)
In Reply To
Got my bike refit last night by a professional: Simril Multisport Coaching - and he made several changes.
Took my seat stub on my P3SL and reversed it, making my seat more forward. Inserted a wedge in my left cleat to make my left knee upright. Took my stem an dropped it all the way. The result of all this, after looking at the photos, this gives me a much more aero position without losing any power. A few slight more changes may happen, but after riding this morning, it felt more aero, felt like I had power when I needed it and I didn't have any back issues from the more aggressive position. The only thing I noticed was my neck and shoulders were getting sore from looking up more than I previously had to - due to the lower position.
Anyone else have this issue? How can I get my neck and shoulders used to this position? Keep riding? Are there stretches I can do or something else?
----
rear wheel
disc ALWAYS
http://www.wheelbuilder.com
if you are poor
front wheel
whatever torodial rim based wheel you want, or an H3. deeper if yer faster shallower if yer slower
tires
-
http://www.biketechreview.com
has crr data, use it
frames
- position trumps aero trumps weight trumps paintjob trumps stiffness
water bottle
between your arms or not at all if its a sprint
swim
get some swim lessons, its cheaper than buying bike speed
train more and HTFU
MarkRebuck
Jul 3, 09 21:48
Post #20 of 26 (245 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [edrusk]
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]
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What about buying higher quality food every day for the next year?
-
-Mark Rebuck,
http://www.markrebuck.com/
jackmott
Jul 3, 09 22:19
Post #21 of 26 (237 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [MarkRebuck]
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that might be good for health or enjoyment
but isn't likely to make ya faster
now..if it could afford you more vacation time to train...
In Reply To
What about buying higher quality food every day for the next year?
-
----
rear wheel
disc ALWAYS
http://www.wheelbuilder.com
if you are poor
front wheel
whatever torodial rim based wheel you want, or an H3. deeper if yer faster shallower if yer slower
tires
-
http://www.biketechreview.com
has crr data, use it
frames
- position trumps aero trumps weight trumps paintjob trumps stiffness
water bottle
between your arms or not at all if its a sprint
swim
get some swim lessons, its cheaper than buying bike speed
train more and HTFU
tjtryon
Jul 3, 09 23:29
Post #22 of 26 (214 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [edrusk]
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In reply to
]
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Put the money in a 90 day CD, see if you can ride 1 mile for every dollar you invest, and if you do, go spend all the money you want on whatever toys you want for your bike, or anything else for that matter, regardless of what anyone else says - you would have earned it. If you don't ride 2000 miles, re-invest the $$$ in another CD and try again.
2000 miles/13 weeks is a tad over 150/wk. I guarantee that will make you faster than anything else you can do, and you get to keep the 2k. It can be quantity miles even - it does not necessarily need to be quality miles. Just ride lots. And don't crash...
edrusk
Jul 4, 09 6:41
Post #23 of 26 (187 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [tjtryon]
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I like that idea! I've always been a goal-setter so you may be on to something here.
Thanks for everyone's input - all this really helps and my wife likes the idea that I'll keep the bike and not be chasing after another high dollar bike.
In Reply To
Put the money in a 90 day CD, see if you can ride 1 mile for every dollar you invest, and if you do, go spend all the money you want on whatever toys you want for your bike, or anything else for that matter, regardless of what anyone else says - you would have earned it. If you don't ride 2000 miles, re-invest the $$$ in another CD and try again.
2000 miles/13 weeks is a tad over 150/wk. I guarantee that will make you faster than anything else you can do, and you get to keep the 2k. It can be quantity miles even - it does not necessarily need to be quality miles. Just ride lots. And don't crash...
tjtryon
Jul 4, 09 11:34
Post #24 of 26 (157 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [edrusk]
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In reply to
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Good. You already have the bike I wish I had, aside from the fact I am spoiled with Dura Ace components and deeper rims. I'd love a well fitting P3, aluminum or carbon. Good luck with the milage. Use some of the money to get your wife some roses.
In Reply To
I like that idea! I've always been a goal-setter so you may be on to something here.
Thanks for everyone's input - all this really helps and my wife likes the idea that I'll keep the bike and not be chasing after another high dollar bike.
In Reply To
Put the money in a 90 day CD, see if you can ride 1 mile for every dollar you invest, and if you do, go spend all the money you want on whatever toys you want for your bike, or anything else for that matter, regardless of what anyone else says - you would have earned it. If you don't ride 2000 miles, re-invest the $$$ in another CD and try again.
2000 miles/13 weeks is a tad over 150/wk. I guarantee that will make you faster than anything else you can do, and you get to keep the 2k. It can be quantity miles even - it does not necessarily need to be quality miles. Just ride lots. And don't crash...
edrusk
Jul 4, 09 11:39
Post #25 of 26 (153 views)
Re: $2,000: Get Carbon Frame or Upgrade components? [tjtryon]
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My wife gets roses from me all the time - what she doesn't get on a regular basis is a new bike: she's being measured for a custom built bike on Sunday - something I've been wanting to give her for a year and she finally caved in. YEA - she'll look hot on it - and we all know it's about the look, right?
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Your tri bike position
Your biggest need is more:
Comfort
Power
Aerodynamics
It's perfect