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Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM

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Hurricane Bob

Jul 2, 09 7:10

Post #1 of 137 (5132 views)

Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM	Can't Post

It took ten years, but it appears that there are now too many people with too much attitude, ruining it for everyone who has raced there before.

http://www.lakeplacidnews.com/...ative-sentiment.html

As a parent of a three-year old, trying to teach her proper manners is a pretty straightforward, yet constant, exercise. I can't comprehend how grown adults can somehow act this way, especially in such a beautiful place. If you make a mess, clean it up! Don't drop wrappers, bottles, or spare tubes. Don't ride in front of cars double-file, and give them attitude when they want to go past - just move over already, and wave thanks for their patience. Wave. Smile. Be nice. PLAY NICE. Leave no trace. You don't own the road - you are borrowing the road, a road that most of the people behind you live near and use every day.

Lake Placid is a small, well-connected town. There is a group made up of the core businesses, and those people basically run the town. They're the families that brought the Olympics there in the 80's, and continue to bring in the big money events, such as the World Cup races, Horse Show, and the like.

In 1998, I remarked to Eric Weiss as we drove through Lake Placid on the way back from Tupper Lake, "Could you imagine what would happen if they decided to hold an Ironman here? How cool would that be?" Little did I know the wheels had been in motion on that dream for years - the following August I volunteered at the Inaugural IM-USA (then only the second IM in North America!), and signed up for the 2000 race the next morning. Those first years were magical - the town loved it; we thought that given enough time the Lake Placid race could become IM Canada East - that soon you'd have 4,000 volunteers, and a city that embraced the race.

But now here we are, ten years on, and the town is looking at the race like a chore - a task - something awful to be endured, and not cherised. That's no way to keep a classic and make it grow. That's no way to treat a town with so much history. That's no way to act like the ambassador of the sport you always are, whether training, or racing. When you are on the road, someone, somewhere, is always watching. Whatever you do (or don't do) to a passing car will be remembered the next time that person sees a cyclist.

So if you're going up to train in these last few weeks, be safe. Be smart. Most of all, be NICE. Let people know you appreciate them hosting the race. Turning the tide on the negative energy won't happen overnight, and can't be done by just one person, but it starts, as all great changes do, with you.

I'd hate to see this race die, but if things keep going on this way, it'll become a gorgeous footnote in IM history...but a tragic one. Don't let that happen. Don't let it go.

Hurricane Bob
* I know I sound like a parent, but I can't help it. If people would stop acting like kids, I wouldn't have to! *

JimH

Jul 2, 09 7:24

Post #2 of 137 (5066 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Hurricane Bob] [In reply to]	Can't Post

I have done 2 tri's. Tupper Lake and IMLP. The area is fantastic. My training partner and I went to Lake Placid numerous times to train and have a yearly Whiteface trip that we do with a bunch of guys from work.

Your comments are right on the money. The scenery is great and the people are very hospitable. It would be a great shame if the IM left Placid. I consider myself a guest when I am down there and would love to be able to compete there again.

Jim

stoptriassletes

Jul 2, 09 7:41

Post #3 of 137 (4977 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Hurricane Bob] [In reply to]	Can't Post

Thank you Hurricane Bob. Everything you said is basically what makes triathletes look bad.

The problem is when all triathletes get grouped in. My wife, friends, family, anybody who's attended an ironman always leave with the "who do these people think they are" attitude that carries on longer than everybody who said thank you for the cheers and waived to a local walking their dog. They remember and talk about the people with a sticker on every side of their car, along with a license plate frame, and the vanity license plate.

Brian in MA

Jul 2, 09 7:46

Post #4 of 137 (4936 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Hurricane Bob] [In reply to]	Can't Post

It would be a shame if the race eventually disappeared because of something like this because it is such a beautiful area and the locals are friendly. It's unfortunate that there have been enough instances of people going up there for the race or for training weekends bringing a sense of entitlement/elitism with them because it puts everyone else in a bad light.

"You can never win or lose if you don't run the race." - Richard Butler

stillrollin

Jul 2, 09 7:51

Post #5 of 137 (4901 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Hurricane Bob] [In reply to]	Can't Post

Interesting read but frankly I'm not surprised. I've been going to Lake Placid for 30+ years and what seems lost on many is that before the Miracle on Ice NOBODY even knew it existed. That brought the winter boom and summer tourists visting other parts of the Adirondacks (e.g Lake George) made the trek to peak thier curiosity. That was all good with/for the locals.

It changed with Ironman. Suddenly the June training camps began and then all out intrusion that is IM week. Sure it was great in the beginning but like most things the novelty has worn off. As the article points out, the local business do well but most locals apparantly view it as a major inconvenience. Add to it the age old cyclists/car battle and it's no wonder that the harmony hasn't lasted.

Overall I think most tri-athletes that go there appreciate it but, I think it like IM in general, IMLP has just gotten to popular for it's own good. If the owners continue to let it expand they may just outgrow the market and wear out their welcome. That would be shame.

Then again, money talks. If they can keep the businesses happy the locals will have to deal.

Slowman

Jul 2, 09 7:56

Post #6 of 137 (4860 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Hurricane Bob] [In reply to]	Can't Post

burnman

Jul 2, 09 8:12

Post #7 of 137 (4777 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Hurricane Bob] [In reply to]	Can't Post

You're spot on. My last two trips up there have been particularly discouraging - observing ALL of the behaviors that you mentioned. So many people remark on the idea that the course is hard. The course is not hard, it's challenging. There's nothing hard about doing what you enjoy in such a fantastic setting. The people that drop into town for the sole purpose of training on the IM course are typically the ones that don't see or treat it that way. It's a nice change to ride in groups, but it's not necessary to ride in packs. Groups share the road. Packs consume the road. And at last check, littering during the race is not permissible ..... so why would you do it in training? The town of LP convenes to put this event together. If things continue on their current path, they have the power to take it apart.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
People don't hate triathletes. They hate our persistent celebration of mediocrity.

Fleck

Jul 2, 09 8:17

Post #8 of 137 (4743 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Slowman] [In reply to]	Can't Post

all that you write is true. but is it anything we didn't see at kona? i don't live in a resort town. by design. the problem isn't ironman or triathletes. the problem will always be there in resort towns. go get us people to fill up our restaurants and buy room nights! as long as they don't actually show up!

Dan,

That is a good counter-point and the issues raised by the article and by Bob, are really nothing new - they have been going on for years in Kona as well as other smaller IM resort oriented towns like Penticton.

That being said having been a around for a few years and having attended many of the big races in the sport in North America over a 20+ year span of time, there has been a decline in the level of civility shown by athletes at races - but this is in keeping with the general decline in civility in our society. So no surprise really. Still sad and unfortinate though.

Steve Fleck
http://www.nineteenwetsuits.com
http://stevefleck.blogspot.com
http://twitter.com/stevefleck

JReed

Jul 2, 09 8:19

Post #9 of 137 (4733 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [stoptriassletes] [In reply to]	Can't Post

Sadly this is happening more and more as people go to ride the courses.

I went to do loops on the Wisc course this past weekend. We drove the connectors to a good spot on the loops and on our way there two cyclists were riding side by side. They saw us there and made no effort to move over....one guy was practically on the yellow lines.

So when I pass...where exactly am I supposed to go and how much room is that jackass expecting?

Normally I am a very good driver when it comes to cyclists...as I am a cyclist and understand. But WTF?

I was ready to pull along side that guy and drop the window to give him a piece of my mind and tell him to get his ass over. But he so close to the fricken line I didn't want to be next to him on the road that long.

It's always a few idiots and assholes that screw it up for everyone. If I am frustrated behind that guy imagine how someone who lives in the area that's in a hurry feels.

At least make an attempt to get single file so cars can pass.

Chris G

Jul 2, 09 8:20

Post #10 of 137 (4732 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Slowman] [In reply to]	Can't Post

Some people bitch about things, it is a fact of life. That "news" article is really a non story. Some people who do not own businesses in town are annoyed by the roads being closed one day a year and clyclists being on the roads in the summer. Those are the same people who bitch about the traffic going to the ski hill in the winter, their neighbors failure to mow the lawn and everything else.

Without the olympics [and that ride is about over as there are now better training facilities other places and 1980 was a long time ago]/horse show/ BBQ cookoff and IM Lake Placid is Tupper Lake or Long Lake or Saranac Lake or Big Moose or one of a thousand other towns that had more people living in it and was a much more popular destination in 1920 than it is today. The advent of air conditioning in the cities and later heap easy air travel killed the tourism industry up there more than anything else.

I spend a lot of time in the adirondacks, a bunch of it on my bike. Never really see a lot of cyclists or anyone else unless I am in either near Lake George village or LP. What I do see are lots of abandoned motels and closed businesses.

jbnc77

Jul 2, 09 8:24

Post #11 of 137 (4708 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Hurricane Bob] [In reply to]	Can't Post

I have done Lake Placid 3x and have met some wonderful people who live in LP and wonderful racers from all over the world. I wish everyone could focus on the 98% of people who are nice and not the 2% that are a-holes. We don't always have to focus on the bad things.

slowhokie

Jul 2, 09 8:29

Post #12 of 137 (4689 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Slowman] [In reply to]	Can't Post

I lived in Panama City for a bit, and among other things saw IM week and bike week (think as may Harleys as Cervelos). I can tell you this, there was alot more jackass-ery from triathletes than from bikers, both on the roads and in the businesses. Probably because biker types better fit in with the Northern FL crowd, but there's some stuff triathletes could do better as the OP described.
Unfortunately I didn't stay in PC through spring break. I bet I would have liked that crowd...

Kentiger

Jul 2, 09 8:29

Post #13 of 137 (4689 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Slowman] [In reply to]	Can't Post

Wow..Dan. What to say to this reply? It would appear that you're defending the assinine actions of Ironman athletes. People who paid $500 over a year in advance for this 'right' to race and feel they are entirely justified in racing however they want as a result. Screw that local driver..I'm a triathlete and I have as much right to this road as they do..my hard earned money is going into their economy and they should be thanking me for holding up their progress to work. And dammit, if I want to throw my used gel package on the road at the same time..I'll damn well do it. What's a piece of litter compared to the couple of thousand I'm dropping into their coffers to be here? And how many of these knobs are here to be able to cross an IM off their life list? Darned right it ruins it for the real triathletes that care about an IM staying in LP. Sure..I'd wager that it is only a handfull of bad apples wrecking it for the rest of you (not me..no IMs in my future either) but how does that old addage go? It takes 20 positive encounters to make up for one bad one (or something along those lines). I'd think it's not as much the one day of IM racing that bugs the locals so much but the ones that come up for training camps well before the event. It's like having the incovenience of an IM every time they show up.
There is a reason YOU don't live in a resort town..but there is a reason that they do. Why are people on vacation justified in making their life suck? Nothing like moving to a really nice out of the way place and then having someone drop an IM in your back yard to make you mad.

Amstel

Jul 2, 09 8:29

Post #14 of 137 (4688 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Hurricane Bob] [In reply to]	Can't Post

In this economy, a town the size of Lake Placid is going to turn it's back on the single biggest one weekend revenue generator of the year? I don't see that happening. At this point Lake Placid needs Ironman way more than Ironman needs Lake Placid.

First they complained that overtime cost for Police was a burden and now they don't like cyclist on their roads. I am sure there are other towns that would be more than happy to host an event that brings $6 million dollars to the local economy.

Reservoir Cat

Jul 2, 09 8:35

Post #15 of 137 (4651 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Slowman] [In reply to]	Can't Post

I think the littering and arrogance are the key though - - yes, when you live in a resort or tourist area you have to tolerate a lot and you should tolerate it because of what it does for the economy but people can take only so much of walking out their front door to find some delusionally self - important athlete pissing in their yard or the never ending supply of triathlete trash along their road sides. I've heard a lot of similar grumblings from people who live along the IMooo course as well.

Millco

Jul 2, 09 8:38

Post #16 of 137 (4636 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Amstel] [In reply to]	Can't Post

"In this economy, a town the size of Lake Placid is going to turn it's back on the single biggest one weekend revenue generator of the year? I don't see that happening. At this point Lake Placid needs Ironman way more than Ironman needs Lake Placid.

First they complained that overtime cost for Police was a burden and now they don't like cyclist on their roads. I am sure there are other towns that would be more than happy to host an event that brings $6 million dollars to the local economy."

Yep, sometimes it's not about the money.

Lake Placid will survive without Ironman, dont kid yourself, it's not the Worlds Fair or the Olympics for goodness sakes.

(This post was edited by Millco on Jul 2, 09 8:39)

GT

Jul 2, 09 8:38

Post #17 of 137 (4636 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Hurricane Bob] [In reply to]	Can't Post

One guy writes a letter and suddenly the whole town hates us? Please. There are people who always hate cyclists- they frequently begin there screed with "As a cyclist...." Residents of small town frequently hate tourists, from spring breakers to snow birds to any convention. And most of these are towns that really need tourism to survive. While there are plenty of cyclists, roadie and triathletes, who wiz in public, toss trash and impede traffic, I would not start worrying about losing the race site over one letter. I have done LP and loved the location. However, there are other towns all over the country that would love a big influx of cash in these horrible economic times. To be honest, I wouldn't mind if all the IM's moved around every few years or so.

---------------

"Remember: a bicycle is an elegant and efficient tool designed for seeking out and defeating people who aren't as good as you."

--BikeSnobNYC

Reservoir Cat

Jul 2, 09 8:38

Post #18 of 137 (4634 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Amstel] [In reply to]	Can't Post

I think most money stays with WTC or to major chain hotels and eateries that triathletes frequent (being a very brand conscious bunch). At IMC, less than 1 mile from the start / finish and along the bike and run course I ate a local restaurant and the server DIDN'T EVEN KNOW it was IM weekend and when we told her it was she seemed "Gee, guess I have to tolerate that crap this weekend. I think they call it a "trickle down" for a reason. It isn't a waterfall.

Kentiger

Jul 2, 09 8:48

Post #19 of 137 (4566 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Reservoir Cat] [In reply to]	Can't Post

I think this is the key RCat..that only certain people get to see the money coming in. The guy who lives two blocks away and hears the announcer blaring in the speakers at 6am on his day off work..who has to wait for hours or get rerouted ten miles to be able to go to the hardware store..who had to put up with IM in training group ride that blocked him from getting to work on time a month earlier (and how to explain that to your boss so he'll give a crap)...he'll never get to see a dime of that money. Maybe. MAYBE the town uses some of the money to improve roads but that might be about it. Sure WTC people will have their salary paid..and some of the food joints and hotels get a week of their bills paid. But for someone to say there are lots of little places around the US that would be happy to put up with triathletes and their self righteous crap is a load. How long before the welcome gets worn out at the new place? As Fleck mentioned..it's about civility and that 20 to 1 ratio. Think about how many self indulgent triathletes actually say a kind word to that guy who live two blocks away from the race venue. And the one who just pissed him off. Think that 20 tell him thanks for putting up with our crap..we love your town? Hell no.

Fleck

Jul 2, 09 8:50

Post #20 of 137 (4550 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [JReed] [In reply to]	Can't Post

Sadly this is happening more and more as people go to ride the courses.

That is something that has really changed. Years ago, we never went on specific training trips/camps to do a recon of the IM courses. Heck, I remember racing the Vineman years ago and essentially riding the bike course blind on race day. RD Russ Pugh just told me to follow the markers on the course and I did. It was a bit disconcerting as I rode solo for 112 miles in 4th or 5th place and other than the first few miles, never saw another competitor. But the markers were all there as Russ said and it was an amzing course/ride!

Steve Fleck
http://www.nineteenwetsuits.com
http://stevefleck.blogspot.com
http://twitter.com/stevefleck

KonaShelley

Jul 2, 09 8:55

Post #21 of 137 (4517 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Amstel] [In reply to]	Can't Post

"I am sure there are other towns that would be more than happy to host an event that brings $6 million dollars to the local economy."

Well said and very true.

I love LP was there just this past weekend. I have been there close to 10 times now over the years Ironman has been present there. I would never have gone to LP had it not been for IM. LP is beautiful and feels like a second home to me. I would hate to see it leave town, but there are many more beautiful places in the US to hold an Ironman I'm sure.
Looking forward to going back there in a couple of weeks for sure!
-----------------
http://www.konashelley.blogspot.com

xtrpickels

Jul 2, 09 8:57

Post #22 of 137 (4501 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Hurricane Bob] [In reply to]	Can't Post

I'm a lake placid local and a triathlete.

Its tough to be both. I find myself having a disdain for the people who come to town. Unfortunately there are too many people who do not respect where they are. You may think that you do and you very well may be one of the few who do respect a place... or you may be ignorant to your actions.

At the same time, LP is a resort town. The area in general (saranac and tupper) seems to be on a steady decline. School enrollment is down etc etc. LP itself thrives on tourism. Without it, it wouldn't exist. IMLP isn't the only event that brings people in, there are events almost every weekend year-round. Its tough for some people to deal with the fact that they need people. Sometimes it seems what you need the most is what you tend to despise.

Things that I have noticed and if everyone could do their part, it would be great.

1. Mirror Lake Beach
There is a garbage problem. The area near the tennis courts is almost always inhabited by triathletes, so they are the ones to blame. The garbage canisters tend to be overflowed and some people stack neatly on the ground next to the can. Those people are great. Thank you to those who throw out your garbage. However, there is always garbage left on the ground elsewhere. Gel wrappers, gatorade bottles etc etc. It may be an unfortunate few, but its more noticable than the many who do it right.

2. Riding your bikes in the road.
a. When on main street. Please obey traffic laws. Cars drive slow. Especially through main street, past the oval and down toward Lisa G's. I understand its fairly easy to go fast on your bike and that its tempting to pass cars or ignore the rules of the road. Don't. You aren't impressing anyone and you look like a jerk.
b. Unfortunately there isn't much shoulder on LP and the area's poorly maintained roads. Its imperative that you are aware while riding your bike. We do not have every right that a car does. Sorry, we don't. I wish the situation were different with huge bike lanes and understanding drivers, but its not. People are either very accomodating or hostile. Its the hostile ones that are scary when they drive. Personally there are roads I don't ride on anymore because I've never been yelled / honked / or had things thrown at me as much as there. Howver, I find myself getting mad at cyclists because their being jerks too. Sometimes I want to pass them, pull over, get out and talk with them. Showing them my bike in the back of my car and saying "Hey, I'm one of you, not a jerky driver, but you really need to ride single file and be more aware."

3. Keep in mind that LP isn't here as your personal training ground and it does not revolve around the race. Each weekend brings tons of triathletes, but also tons of other tourists. You are not king shit on crap mountain.

4. Be humble. There's no need to go around professing the ultra-long day you've had. Don't boast about your fast day on the bike when earlier I passed you on my road bike while you had on your race wheels, aero helmet and were cruising at a sweet 9 mph heading up the hill past the ski jumps.

We all make mistakes. There's been times when I was in the lane riding to avoid the numerous pot holes and impeded a car. It happens and I hate being "that guy". The locals aren't perfect, neither are the out of towners. That means that everyone should pull together to do their part in making the situations as good as possible.

Thanks for listening to the rant.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Lactate Threshold Testing- Adirondack Medical Center- Lake Placid, NY
PM me if you would like information
www.amccares.org

Amstel

Jul 2, 09 8:58

Post #23 of 137 (4494 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Millco] [In reply to]	Can't Post

According to your reasoning Detroit will survive without the automakers.

According to the most recent estimate Lake Placid has a population of 2800 people. If the $6 million figure is accurate, that is over $2100 per resident. For comparison purposes a city like Atlanta with a pop of 5.5 million would have to host an event that generated $11,550,000.00. I don't think we would complain about some Gu rappers in our yard.

Paulo Sousa

Jul 2, 09 8:59

Post #24 of 137 (4493 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Hurricane Bob] [In reply to]	Can't Post

'"entitlement and elitest" best describes many of the athlete's attitude and behavior.'

Somebody needs to stop this lying propaganda!!!!
-

pstriathlon.com

roady

Jul 2, 09 9:02

Post #25 of 137 (4472 views)

Re: Lake Placid Businesses Growing Weary of IM [Fleck] [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

That being said having been a around for a few years and having attended many of the big races in the sport in North America over a 20+ year span of time, there has been a decline in the level of civility shown by athletes at races - but this is in keeping with the general decline in civility in our society. So no surprise really. Still sad and unfortinate though.

maybe you're right. I'm not a triathlete, and I don't go to triathlons--so maybe things have gotten worse in your sport.

I go to a lot of bike races though (and have for almost as many years) and I just haven't seen the 'decline in the level of civility'. If anything I actually think it's gotten slightly better due to heightened awareness and the ease of threatening racers via the internet! There's probably less litter and less public urination than there used to be.

I really haven't seen it in society, either. People have been harping about this since Plato's time. People always seem to have rose-colored glasses about 'back in the day'. It's a sign you're getting old when you start believing it....

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