Thanks for that video view. I see between 7:54 and 8:00 the swing across the road.

We really should be discssing the racing, not where we are or not allowed to discuss the racing.

But since we are discussing about posting and conventions, let me explain to you my view on how media works.

Media works on the principle of "fresh news". The word "news" implies "new"

Park that thought for a moment.

In an age far goneby, we can use the Tour De France as an ultimate example of how media works and that fresh matter is needed to refresh the media cycle and keep it relevant.

The Tour de France used to start off on a given day and riders would then commence a pre determined route around France.

Typically after a few days, there was no NEWS. The order was established. Nothing was changing. L'Equipe started the race off as a publicity stunt to sell newspapers, but soon there was nothing new to read about so newspapers did not sell.

A few geniuses realized that the bike race needed a story every day, because new stories sold newspapers.

So they divided the race up into daily stages, with daily winners, daily standings, daily stories, daily newspaper sales.

EVERY DAY THE TITLE OF THE TOUR DE FRANCE "THREAD" ON L'EQUIPE CHANGED


This is before the internet.

This is how humans interact with news. They interact with fresh news. Imagine if Equipe gave you an extra page every day to append to your collection of pages to build up a month long story? Would they sell more or less newspapers?

The answer is NO.

The internet is just an electronic version of news.

New headlines create excitement and engagement.

All of the above is my opinion, but I graduated from university 1.5 years before CERN released the hypertext transfer protocol. I used written press to my advantage in college creating content and publishing on campus in print. I literally saw how I could use stories and headlines to influence masses of other students....just saying the same stupid thing with a different headline, but it created buzz.

So I think you all have it backwards, because you don't have a great grasp of the fundamentals of how readers interact with media.

It's my 2 cents worth. Generating new content with new headlines has been proven from the dawn of the interaction between the third and fourth estates of society. A few people talking to themselves in a corner does not create a mass effect and I THINK Ryan and Eric want larger engagement not smaller engagement.

Now can we go back to discussing the racing rather than debating where people are allowed to talk about the racing?

I wonder if Wout Van Aert was not out of commission if the chase had that one extra person of horsepower needed to chase down Van Der Poel. Van Aert would have a few extra days coming down from alitude camp and a few extra days on cobbles. At E3, he seemed to have done an insane pull to bring himself back so it seems like his fitness would have been useful in the chase today.

Dev,
A short post to say I completely agree with your sentiments.
I am relatively time poor and scroll the forum a few times at least each day. I don't have the "engagement" to go into a dedicated 2024 bike racing thread every time I want to read about a specific race-I far prefer to see individual threads on the races in the forum as that will get my attention and make me want to read etc.

I saw this text (from cyclingnews.com) about the Koppenburg carnage. Looking at the replay only a few made it up without walking (MVDP, Mads Pederson, Matteo Jorgenson):

Behind them, however, came a litany of riders unclipping and walking their bikes up the hill in a desperate attempt to stay in the hunt for a podium spot. They must already have guessed, of course, that Van der Poel’s rainbow jersey would not be seen again before the finish in Oudenaarde.
Indeed, the vast majority of those hunting Van der Poel didn’t even catch sight of him on the climb itself. The Tour of Flanders tends to have that effect, and this was a particularly extreme edition, bedevilled by miserable conditions and constant attacking. By the last 100km here, most riders were wearily chasing the race rather than actively participating in it.
Matteo Trentin (Tudor), 19th, counted himself among their number when he reached the finish of what he cheerfully described as “a bit of a shit day.” Despite his chattering teeth, the Italian paused briefly in the mixed zone to talk reporters through the Koppenberg, though he was unaware at that point that anyone had managed to ride up it.

Personally I also prefer the one thread per race format.


But i have also seen the multiple complaints in the past. Ryan himself just guided people to keeping a single thread for all ITU events.


The guys that keep the racing thread going do it in that format because that is where they were guided. I really enjoy their thread. It's actually one of the few threads that keeps going and going. Could a few tweaks be done to maybe get more engagement. Of course. And all of those guys are open minded enough to accomodate them.


The "I'll do what I want, F that thread", IMO, is not a step towards the claims of "collaboration oriented".


There is a French expression "on récolte ce qu'on sème". I had to google it and it's "you reap what you sow". Then I had to look up what reap and sow mean :-) It's been an educuational morning. On this path, not hard to see where the forum will end up in 2030.

Can we discuss the race rather than where to post about the race? There could be ten different threads with ten different slants each covering different items and you participate in whichever you want. Its like a bar, there are thirty different groups who may be talking about their favourite left or right wing public policy and all conversations are valid and can coexist in different human interactions

Anyone seen the overhead video of the Matthews DQ. Link?

Any post race interviews with Pederson that you all have a link to. I am curious to hear how he felt after his midweek crash. I heard that he wanted to make the race a grind because he felt his peak power may have been hurt.

“If Ryan doesn’t like what I post he can ban me” , your words

Finally saw an overhead view, and this goes down as one of the great bullshit calls in cycling history. Totally ridiculous...


https://twitter.com/lukamezgec/status/1774452187038453770

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Tech writer/support on this here site. FIST school instructor and certified bike fitter. Formerly at Diamondback Bikes, LeMond Fitness, FSA, TiCycles, etc.
Coaching and bike fit - http://source-e.net/ Cyclocross blog - https://crosssports.net/ BJJ instruction - https://ballardbjj.com/

I guess I need to wonder over to the cycling thread and see what the "experts" thought of the move (ha although they may have already moved on). Let me reword it- it def looked like he drifted across the road and it was even closer to the barrier a few seconds after going near the barrier. It looked like a pretty wide veer across the road?

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

I don't think most folks have actually read the rules on this. There's a two part test for relegation in a sprint, deviation and endangerment. Part one is there for sure, but part two? No.

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Tech writer/support on this here site. FIST school instructor and certified bike fitter. Formerly at Diamondback Bikes, LeMond Fitness, FSA, TiCycles, etc.
Coaching and bike fit - http://source-e.net/ Cyclocross blog - https://crosssports.net/ BJJ instruction - https://ballardbjj.com/

Wow thanks for the overhead shot:

https://twitter.com/.../1774452187038453770

I made it live so people can click on it. There was plenty of room from that angle, as was articulated on some internet comments on youtube, so it was good to finally see it.

While it was a wide veer from the front view (that I posted earlier), I was told on the overhead view yesterday that it was not that bad if viewed from there (and if you were the rider in the bunch having to deal with it) . We can all Monday morning QB this.

Here is an age old one somewhat similar but more rider overlap between Steve Bauer and Claude Criquilon at the 1988 worlds:

https://www.facebook.com/...h/?v=586506408629774

It's more like the Cav vs Sagan one from a few years ago with elbows coming out. On the scale of those the Matthews relegation I can see why there is debate yesterday and today

I would aassume "endaagerment" has sorta a wide interpetation, and I would assume if you veer that far with others on your wheel, your sorta setting yourself up to be dinged for that violation in this violation. I just didnt think it was that much of a bullshit call. But this is from the children's table pov lol.

Although it looks like even though the door was sorta being closed on the other rider, I don't think he actually had any legs to push through and sprint past. It looked like he was sorta ok with where he was, so I guess in that aspect, I can see what you mean.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Mads and MdVP finished on the same time. :)

If you look at the context of the sprint, then yes, there was endangerment.

The sprint started on the left side of the road (if looking from overhead).

They caught the two in front so the only possible line at that point is to the right of those two riders.

Mathews' line was the middle of the road. He moved to the white line in the center of the road where he had ample room to pass those two (which also blocked anyone from passing on his left) and the only line for every other person at that point was to the right of Matthews.

But THEN, he moved right from the white line. Anyone coming up on his wheel (and he knew they were), absolutely had no way to go to his left without hitting the brakes. And at 35+ mph, even letting up off the pedals in a sprint like that loses you the sprint by lengths.

So by him moving to the right, all the way right, he was putting whoever was immediately on his wheel nearly into the barriers.

Which is what is evident on both video angles. And which is what the commissaires saw. And is why he was DQed.

This stuff has ended so badly in the past. It's why there has to be DQs. Matthews knows all about this. I can only imagine the fatigue and suffering of the prior 6 hours was the main cause, but still.

If I look at the overhead did Matthews who was coming up on the two in second and third (Tuens and Bettiol) swing right so these guys would not be able to latch on, versus trying to cut off Pollitt? Its like he used their draft to the last second and built speed then veered wide of them so they have no hope to latch on? We've all done that after slingshotting off a draft, the question is if we put others in danger

You're correct in your assessment of the sprint derivation, but I'll note that Mozzato was further (or at least the same) past Pollitt's wheel than Pollitt was past Matthew's wheel (everyone on the right). Mozzato sees what's about to happen, brakes/coasts to clear the wheel, and then comes around from 3rd position to beat both Pollitt and Matthews.

I was just listening to Hincapie talking about Flanders. In his 16 or 17 races, he said he made it up the Koppenburg every time pedaling and his small gear was only a 39x25....and they probably had their tires inflated to a zillion psi back then too!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bw_orKTt3CE

Lance had a good description saying it is like the combo of Liege Bastogne Liege + Paris- Roubaix.