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Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1
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Canyon cfr V trek speed concept sl7 (P1)
So I’m lucky enough to have both these bikes available to me right now , pretty much same price

Just wondering on any feedback on either bikes

Sc will only have ultegra as cfr will have DA (both di2)
Sc won’t have power , cfr will but I have a power meter

Sc will have sl wheels which I think will be better than the dt Swiss
Sc will be lighter and possibly more comfortable with the iso set up , and will have local backing of bike shop V cfr with online support only

I was leaning towards the canyon , but the sc just became available so I’m probably now leaning towards the SC
Thoughts ?
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [ironpo] [ In reply to ]
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Pick the bike that fits you better.

blog
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [ironpo] [ In reply to ]
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I have the Canyon CFR and love it. I did check my fit coordinates and it was perfect.
Trek makes a great bike, but does cost a bit more. The DT Swiss wheels are every bit as good as the Zipps I had in my previous Canyon.
The built in power meter is a nice. The Dura Ace Di2 synchro shift works flawlessly.

Team Zoot So Cal
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [ironpo] [ In reply to ]
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What are SL wheels on the P1? The ARC 1100 on the CFR are as good and fast as it gets.
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [ironpo] [ In reply to ]
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Local bike shop should include free fit for the SC as well as stock the proprietary parts to adjust the fit any number of ways. That advantage will continue for the life of the bike as you wish to make adjustments or need small parts.
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [BeastTri] [ In reply to ]
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I was interested in both, and I took a Speedmax which I am really very happy with (I already had it before but with classic braking).
The DT Swiss are great wheels, both bikes are very good, but the nightmare is the SC cockpit. Look at the pros: no one uses the original one because not enough adaptation is possible because of the Trek system (which is easy to adjust), but the bars are not round, so you have to change everything.
In France, the Canayon service is excellent, and I don't know how it will be in your country.
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [ironpo] [ In reply to ]
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Hello!


Both are high-end bikes, I don't think you can go wrong with neither of them.

I've moved from a 2013 Cérvelo P5-Six to a Trek SC SLR7 P1 this year. I'm very happy with the bike, performance wise it is very similar honestly, the obvious differences are the disk brakes and the wheels running larger tires (which I'm really enjoying btw).

Thinks to consider that might help you choose:

- Crank arm length, the SC only comes with 172.5mm if I'm not mistaken, check with your LBS, I replaced the Shimano one for a Rotor ALDHU 165mm. Maybe Canyon has more options.

- With Canyon you have the chance to get extended arm pads, for the SC you may need to look for Tririg scoops or other and this may limit the BTA usage. Although they are not cushy the flat bars works as extended arm support for me. (hint: Cee Gees makes outstanding cushy pads even for this SC pad).

- Both wheels are great! However I had the chance to choose between the RSL 51, 65 and 75 without affecting the price (I've chosen the 75 front and rear), so you can probably choose the profile you prefer.

- Race setup, with the Trek BTA you can also add another bottle above the BTA bottle. It is nice although I don't see many people using it (I use it). Heard a pro complaining that on some descends, Nice course, it affected the bike stability.

- Trek frame aero bottle, it is great, it holds +-750ml however just like any other aero bottle they are not thermal. They slide in and out easily, but if you don't like it you can switch for one or two bottle cages of your preference.

- The SC internal storage I could only fit these TPU/Latex tubes. A standard butyl one I have a really hard timing fitting it together with the fact that I could potentially damage the tube. The Canyon one looks much "easier", but I have no experience.

- The SC top tube storage (bento box) is big, you can fit bars, gels etc. and can be removed easily to clean.

- I can't say much about the ISO speed, but it is a very enjoyable bike to ride.

- A friend had issues with a plastic part that holds the straw on his CFR, he that to import it from Germany and the shipping + taxes were way more expensive than the spare part itself.
Last edited by: lcparlatto: Oct 27, 23 10:02
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [ironpo] [ In reply to ]
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Easy. Speed Concept. The Trek's have been up there with Cervelo in terms of aerodynamics for a long time. I don't think I've seen an aero/wind tunnel comparison to the Canyon, except for Sam Laidlow's velodrome video. In the video, they had to work very hard to get the Canyon as fast as the Trek. What is meaningful, is they had a team of experts to help Sam with his aerodynamics, while the Trek he setup himself for Kona with no testing.

Then you also get the support of your local Trek dealer.

Unless you have unusual body dimensions, you can get it to fit.
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [lcparlatto] [ In reply to ]
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lcparlatto wrote:
.....

- The SC internal storage I could only fit these TPU/Latex tubes. A standard butil one I have a really hard timing fitting it together with the fact that I could potentially damage the tube. The Canyon one looks much "easier", but I have no experience.
....


Have you tried removing the storage holder from the cover, and then just putting whatever you want into a bag and inside the frame? I thought that was what a lot of folks were doing to get around the tiny stock tube/c02 'holder'.
Last edited by: SBRcanuck: Oct 27, 23 6:32
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [SBRcanuck] [ In reply to ]
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SBRcanuck wrote:
lcparlatto wrote:
.....

- The SC internal storage I could only fit these TPU/Latex tubes. A standard butyl one I have a really hard timing fitting it together with the fact that I could potentially damage the tube. The Canyon one looks much "easier", but I have no experience.
....


Have you tried removing the storage holder from the cover, and then just putting whatever you want into a bag and inside the frame? I thought that was what a lot of folks were doing to get around the tiny stock tube/c02 'holder'.

I haven't tried yet, but I got this "hack" here on the forum and I intend to make a try in the next days. Currently I replaced the frame aero bottle with 2 Xlab Gorilla XT cages, but downtube cage kind of blocks the cover.
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [applenutt] [ In reply to ]
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applenutt wrote:
Easy. Speed Concept. The Trek's have been up there with Cervelo in terms of aerodynamics for a long time. I don't think I've seen an aero/wind tunnel comparison to the Canyon, except for Sam Laidlow's velodrome video. In the video, they had to work very hard to get the Canyon as fast as the Trek. What is meaningful, is they had a team of experts to help Sam with his aerodynamics, while the Trek he setup himself for Kona with no testing.

Then you also get the support of your local Trek dealer.

Unless you have unusual body dimensions, you can get it to fit.

Absolute rubbish. How do you know how the bikes compared and which was more aero or how hard they had to work, was there data published?
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [BeastTri] [ In reply to ]
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BeastTri wrote:
Local bike shop should include free fit for the SC as well as stock the proprietary parts to adjust the fit any number of ways. That advantage will continue for the life of the bike as you wish to make adjustments or need small parts.

Most bike shops aren’t going to have the different options for the base bar, tower toppers, or tower bases. You order those specific parts during a p1 build and they aren’t cheap if you get it wrong. Best bet is to know your fit coordinates before you order.

Fit the bike to the rider. Not the other way around.

blog
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [lcparlatto] [ In reply to ]
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lcparlatto wrote:
Hello!


Both are high-end bikes, I don't think you can go wrong with neither of them.

I've moved from a 2013 Cérvelo P5-Six to a Trek SC SLR7 P1 this year. I'm very happy with the bike, performance wise it is very similar honestly, the obvious differences are the disk brakes and the wheels running larger tires (which I'm really enjoying btw).

Thinks to consider that might help you choose:

- Crank arm length, the SC only comes with 172.5mm if I'm not mistaken, check with your LBS, I replaced the Shimano one for a Rotor ALDHU 165mm. Maybe Canyon has more options.

- With Canyon you have the chance to get extended arm pads, for the SC you may need to look for Tririg scoops or other and this may limit the BTA usage. Although they are not cushy the flat bars works as extended arm support for me. (hint: Cee Gees makes outstanding cushy pads even for this SC pad).

- Both wheels are great! However I had the chance to choose between the RSL 51, 65 and 75 without affecting the price (I've chosen the 75 front and rear), so you can probably choose the profile you prefer.

- Race setup, with the Trek BTA you can also add another bottle above the BTA bottle. It is nice although I don't see many people using it (I use it). Heard a pro complaining that on some descends, Nice course, it affected the bike stability.

- Trek frame aero bottle, it is great, it holds +-750ml however just like any other aero bottle they are not thermal. They slide in and out easily, but if you don't like it you can switch for one or two bottle cages of your preference.

- The SC internal storage I could only fit these TPU/Latex tubes. A standard butyl one I have a really hard timing fitting it together with the fact that I could potentially damage the tube. The Canyon one looks much "easier", but I have no experience.

- The SC top tube storage (bento box) is big, you can fit bars, gels etc. and can be removed easily to clean.

- I can't say much about the ISO speed, but it is a very enjoyable bike to ride.

- A friend had issues with a plastic part that holds the straw on his CFR, he that to import it from Germany and the shipping + taxes were way more expensive than the spare part itself.
Thanks
Nice write up
Ended up going the trek , no real reason just mainly due to the lbs in case I need them

I have a couple of canyon bikes ,while they are great , ordering the bike itself and then getting parts or changing bits is never simple

I have a aero coach aero bar set up coming that’s made fir the SC so it will be fitted at the shop so I’ll never deal with the standard bar that a lot complain about
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [ironpo] [ In reply to ]
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Congrats, but how often do you ever buy parts for a bike that aren't part of a group set readily available at any bike shop?
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [applenutt] [ In reply to ]
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applenutt wrote:
Easy. Speed Concept. The Trek's have been up there with Cervelo in terms of aerodynamics for a long time. I don't think I've seen an aero/wind tunnel comparison to the Canyon, except for Sam Laidlow's velodrome video. In the video, they had to work very hard to get the Canyon as fast as the Trek. What is meaningful, is they had a team of experts to help Sam with his aerodynamics, while the Trek he setup himself for Kona with no testing.

Then you also get the support of your local Trek dealer.

Unless you have unusual body dimensions, you can get it to fit.


The aero comparison you mention here is BS. At what point in the video do they make that claim? I'd bet my balls the SwissSide designed CFR is faster than the new SC. Did trek ever release any data compared to the rim brake SC?

I can think of reasons to get the Trek but aero isn't one of them.
Last edited by: BigBoyND: Oct 28, 23 0:03
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [BigBoyND] [ In reply to ]
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BigBoyND wrote:
applenutt wrote:
Easy. Speed Concept. The Trek's have been up there with Cervelo in terms of aerodynamics for a long time. I don't think I've seen an aero/wind tunnel comparison to the Canyon, except for Sam Laidlow's velodrome video. In the video, they had to work very hard to get the Canyon as fast as the Trek. What is meaningful, is they had a team of experts to help Sam with his aerodynamics, while the Trek he setup himself for Kona with no testing.

Then you also get the support of your local Trek dealer.

Unless you have unusual body dimensions, you can get it to fit.


The aero comparison you mention here is BS. At what point in the video do they make that claim? I'd bet my balls the SwissSide designed CFR is faster than the new SC. Did trek ever release any data compared to the rim brake SC?

I can think of reasons to get the Trek but aero isn't one of them.

3:30 into the video Sam says they worked long and found maybe 3 or 4 watts versus his old setup on his old bike. That’s position and bike setup comparisons and does not include helmet changes. However it does include Canyon’s integrated aerobar setup.
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [applenutt] [ In reply to ]
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applenutt wrote:
BigBoyND wrote:
applenutt wrote:
Easy. Speed Concept. The Trek's have been up there with Cervelo in terms of aerodynamics for a long time. I don't think I've seen an aero/wind tunnel comparison to the Canyon, except for Sam Laidlow's velodrome video. In the video, they had to work very hard to get the Canyon as fast as the Trek. What is meaningful, is they had a team of experts to help Sam with his aerodynamics, while the Trek he setup himself for Kona with no testing.

Then you also get the support of your local Trek dealer.

Unless you have unusual body dimensions, you can get it to fit.


The aero comparison you mention here is BS. At what point in the video do they make that claim? I'd bet my balls the SwissSide designed CFR is faster than the new SC. Did trek ever release any data compared to the rim brake SC?

I can think of reasons to get the Trek but aero isn't one of them.


3:30 into the video Sam says they worked long and found maybe 3 or 4 watts versus his old setup on his old bike. That’s position and bike setup comparisons and does not include helmet changes. However it does include Canyon’s integrated aerobar setup.

Crickets...funny how those who called me full of crap are quiet. Must be Canyon owners.
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [applenutt] [ In reply to ]
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applenutt wrote:
[quote applenutt
3:30 into the video Sam says they worked long and found maybe 3 or 4 watts versus his old setup on his old bike. That’s position and bike setup comparisons and does not include helmet changes. However it does include Canyon’s integrated aerobar setup.

Crickets...funny how those who called me full of crap are quiet. Must be Canyon owners.[/quote]
Nope, just don't waste as much time as you on ST. Don't even have notifications turned on for replies, so I don't see most of them.

That comment by SL says nothing about the bikes, just that he was dialed and it's hard to find another 3-4 watts at zero yaw, as expected.

The rim brake SC was proven fast, but Trek hasn't been eager to share an apple to apple comparison with their old bike, which tells us something. At launch they said it saves X minutes only to explain its because of the wheels, the BTA, and the extensions. Frame got wider and more truncated. Reminded me a bit of the Shiv launch.

I'd trust Ballard to have the faster design. You won't know til you test yourself but some bets are safer than others.
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [ironpo] [ In reply to ]
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ironpo wrote:
[..]
I have a aero coach aero bar set up coming that’s made fir the SC so it will be fitted at the shop so I’ll never deal with the standard bar that a lot complain about

What are the complaints about the stock cockpit setup?

I never installed it but I have all the parts ( I installed the Aerocoach setup on the initial build) and I was curious about swapping just to compare and see.

If your Aerocoach bars have not shipped yet, and if you've never tried them: have a look at the angle of the handles versus the bar. I find they are a bit too parallel for comfort so far from me 0 I have to bend my wrist a bit too much. I do wish the angle of the handles was a bit steeper. They can make it so if you tell them ahead of time - can't be replaced later.
Looking at the recent LS video where he did aero testing, he seems to have the same Ascalon bars but with steeper angles on the handles, which appears more comfortable than stock.

Just thought I would mention it.

---------------------------------
T. Guertin / Spocket
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [spocket] [ In reply to ]
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spocket wrote:
ironpo wrote:

[..]
I have a aero coach aero bar set up coming that’s made fir the SC so it will be fitted at the shop so I’ll never deal with the standard bar that a lot complain about


What are the complaints about the stock cockpit setup?

I never installed it but I have all the parts ( I installed the Aerocoach setup on the initial build) and I was curious about swapping just to compare and see.

If your Aerocoach bars have not shipped yet, and if you've never tried them: have a look at the angle of the handles versus the bar. I find they are a bit too parallel for comfort so far from me 0 I have to bend my wrist a bit too much. I do wish the angle of the handles was a bit steeper. They can make it so if you tell them ahead of time - can't be replaced later.
Looking at the recent LS video where he did aero testing, he seems to have the same Ascalon bars but with steeper angles on the handles, which appears more comfortable than stock.

Just thought I would mention it.
Thanks
Yeah they have allready shipped and to honest I didn’t do sot of research on the bars pre purchase as I neded the fast so they can be built into my new build
I’m not even gunna try the stock bars as they are too wide for me

I’m hopeing they will be ok as I’ve run just straight aero bars for years , which in theory could be worse on your wrist than the. Aero coach bars
Time will tell I suppose
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [spocket] [ In reply to ]
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spocket wrote:

What are the complaints about the stock cockpit setup?

You are stuck using their ski bend extensions and can’t put on something like 51ss bars to get your hands high. You can’t get fine adjustment of tilt. You can’t get the extensions tips close together.

The gen 2 had mono plug in that you could run any round extensions you wanted. That part was loved by most sc owners. With the gen 3, it feels like a step backward to not have that functionality and being stuck running stock extensions without having to fork over a lot of money and hacking up a solution.

blog
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [ironpo] [ In reply to ]
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ironpo wrote:
{...}
I’m hoping they will be ok as I’ve run just straight aero bars for years , which in theory could be worse on your wrist than the. Aero coach bars
Time will tell I suppose

I guess it just felt like a step backward for me (for comfort) after 1.5 seasons riding 51 SS extensions at a steeper ~41 deg angle on the ends. But it's really not that bad.
Yes, you'll be OK if you were riding straight or S-Bend bars before! Enjoy the new bars - sleek looking!

---------------------------------
T. Guertin / Spocket
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [stevej] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks for the clarifications ont he complaints of the new SC cockpit.
Makes sense.

I had 2 Gen 2s (I have one left) and converted both to the plugin and 51 SS extensions and it was the best. Trek must have sold a boatload of plugin adapters for the Gen 2's. You would think they would have taken the hint to offer it - at least as an aftermarket option - from the beginning for Gen 3 - seems like an easy way to make a buck with post-sale accessories, knowing this will be successful.

The wide spacing of the stock extension grips was one good reason I went with the Aerocoach extension from the beginning.

---------------------------------
T. Guertin / Spocket
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [spocket] [ In reply to ]
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I had 2 sc’s as well and still have 1. Both were setup with 51ss extensions and cups.

The only thing I don’t like about the aero coach (and same with wattshop) is the length of the extensions. Correct me if I’m wrong, but there isn’t different lengths available and if you have longer arms, you will have to rest more on your forearms vs your elbows.

I’m still waiting for the perfect aftermarket setup but I don’t think it exists yet. Hopefully I can get my hands on the prints4watts solution that he has teased around. It seems promising so far.

blog
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Re: Canyon cfr V trek speed concept P1 [stevej] [ In reply to ]
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Aerocoach: With the stock extensions, for the length of the extensions themselves to back of pad, there's 4 lines of screws to mount the arm rests, so you can safely extend by ~35mm.. Maybe 50 mm if you only use the last 2 screws and let the pads hang in the back further.

But in a recent FB post of them where they featured my cockpit (red and blue SC), they answered to someone else and said they can extend the shaft length by 10mm increments up to an extra 40 mm.

---------------------------------
T. Guertin / Spocket
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