Probably more "TBA" in terms of they have most stuff lined up, just trying to finish T&Cs. But I also think they didn't want to miss another self-imposed deadline...

Gonna be a good year to be a pro triathlete in 2024.

Very curious to see what they put together for an age group experience. (Edit to add -- seeing as it's the weekend before my wife does IM California, it's probably going to be VERY frowned upon for me to wind up at Lake Las Vegas. But that might be the best shot...)

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

Not a lot of big names missing. On the men's side, the Norway boys and Lange. Any other surprises?

Neumann is a bit of a surprise for taking a flyer.

The six race mandatory thing is going to make it tough, IMO, to nab an IMWC qualification, and peak for IMWC, with the amount of racing surrounding it. Not impossible, but tough.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

Very excited to see Taylor Spivey in the list. I’ve been waiting for her to give it a go at middle distance.

Womens field is far stronger and more interesting than the men.

Will also be interesting to see the injury rates for these athletes. That is a lot of very hard racing plus at least one Ironman and two for many of them over a very long season.

Great schedule and great pros they signed. I am looking forward to watching. Also excited to see if they make a show like 'Drive to Survive' for streaming. I would love to attend one of these events as an age grouper, but nothing quite works out with my schedule for this year. Next year for sure though.

Ibiza is the week after the Ironman Championship in Nice. Looks like most of the top women are committed to the T100 series. As noted, that is going to be interesting. Will be interesting to see who shows up on Nice.

Renouf interview available (30 Jan, 1100 CST):
https://podcasts.apple.com/...ri-news/id1559781865
"The majority of the venues are 3 to 5 year deals"

I think it's more likely the PTO fields are poor on the women's side at Ibiza and on the mens side in Vegas. Or those athletes that raced will just go through the motions to clock one of their six races.

Two other thoughts:

1.) LCB announces she won't defend IMWC at today's press conference, will only race in Kona. That's not super shocking given her injury history -- but I'm sure IM is going to be a little perturbed at that.

2.) As a self-proclaimed golf nut, all I think about with that T100 name -- Titleist irons.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

Does this mean Marten isn’t going to the Olympics?

I was also surprised not to see Hayden’s name here, but I imagine he’ll get a start at every race he wants after Paris. Same for Kristian and Gustav.

One would think for them to be able to announce London they had pay a bit more than they wanted ,as it would look like it was a last minute thing.
One would assume Abu Dhabi will be on the formula one circuit which is a great course .

I guess the only thing that is missing is a race on the euro landmass

Super female field

Do we know race price money and season bonuses ?

asianzone wrote:

It’s a very good program, PTO did a great job with so much flexibility, only need to commit to 5 races (including grand finals) which gives athletes a chance to do an IM or Roth, and qualify for W.

I disagree. For one its 6 races (5+GF) so little flexibility other than athletes participating in the Olympics also (3+GF). But my major gripe is that the California race has no location & no date and the Grand Finale has no location. It literally could be anywhere in the world..............

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Pink? Maybe. Maybe not. You decide.

Athletes going to the olympics have special contracts and don't have to race the full slate of races

It's in the front page story.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

As for point 1 that is quite a hit for ironman is this the first time since mark alen went to Nice that an ironman world champ snubs the race ?

In a way, this may be a message being to sent to IM (not purposefully). If the women's race was in kona this year, would LCB's decision be same? I don't think this was the sole reason, someone mentioned her injuries, but you have to think the race being in Nice was a factor in her decision.

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Neumann was highly ranked (ie top #10) when PTO did their first cut in August (same as Lawrence was).
Agree tough. And those with an IMWC AQ will have to validate (only Ditlev has so far of the ?13 AQd).
PTO have annotated the Ranking list showing those contracted to T100.
https://stats.protriathletes.org/rankings/women
https://stats.protriathletes.org/rankings/men
Pleased to see Byram and Duffy taking contracts; note no Langridge.
Renouf: "the Grand Final will have more points. . . . the final stage in the Middle East".

Perhaps true. But looks like LCB has announced she won't be going to Nice. Also, with that commitment from the women to the T100, I'm curious who is going to be committed to the Ironman series. Does it seem like the women have spoken and they are going with the PTO? I may be missing something, so interested to see how the analysis and announcements come out.

I thought PTO World Tour was a better name.

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-Of course it's 'effing hard, it's IRONMAN!
Team ZOOT
ZOOT, QR, Garmin, HED Wheels, Zealios, FormSwim, Precision Hydration, Rudy Project

I would guess world triathlon butchered that.

I don't hate the rebrand because, if you're going to play aggressively in the age group space (which they have to with the World Triathlon alignment)...PTO doesn't work.

Tri100 might have worked. (Also an easy tie in to some first-timer programs you might work). But someone in the UK already owns that for their "100 Olympic distance tris in 100 days" thing.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

I remember some folks talking like Nice was going to be the crown jewel in the Grand Final series, guess we can put that to bed now. Virtually all of the women here were/are the contenders for that championship, and they have now chosen to either not do it, or make it just another race. in their year.

I love the fields they have put together, gonna be some very exciting racing for sure. Sam Laidlow is a tiny bit of a surprise, but perhaps not really. He is going for the guarantee and now just has to do the shorter 100k races. He has not shown consistency in the past, so he probably is making the right decision here. Still gets to pitch up for Kona, one race that can make your whole season.

Love the addition of the ITU ladies, seems the protests of the lack of money in ITU is finally taking hold. Can't wait to see how Spivey translates her superior bike power into a TT. All those ladies will be in the front of any race for quite sometime, maybe until the end. Several that can swim on Lucy's feet, so no more solo off the front type races.

And I really hope Ali and Javi can get back to their old form, both those guys could be there at the end too still I believe. IF Jan can win one of these against the best at 42, then age shouldn't be a factor(besides the obvious getting injured more easily)

So is the CA race going to be in Malibu? One would think they didnt pony up that $300k for nothing. That would be fun to watch, perhaps a few more loops that normal, but with such small fields and the new draft tracker, should be fine...If it were not an olympic year, I would say this is the top series on the circuit. Certainly on par even with the games happening...

Sam said that there were some things about PTO that don't work - like in the States, it means paid time off for almost everyone. I think it was a Formula 1 type rebrand - trying to make it special and while it's not perfect, it will shortly become part of "the narrative" I think and we won't think much about it.

We all hate change. haha

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DFRU - Detta Family Racing Unit...the kids like it and we all get out and after it...gotta keep the fam involved!

I'm happy this is a BIG F U to Ironman for their ridiculous money grab that is their World Championships in France... Good on Ryf & Lucy Charles

He was asked that in the PTN podcast.

No, it's not in the short term future plans (meaning the first couple of years) for Malibu to be a location but never say never

He made up some reason for the donation to be preserving the celebrity race aspect of Malibu as celebrities being eyeballs.

Gripe ye not oh negative one!
The calendar shows that the Grand Final will be 28/29 Nov (earnestly recommend you cut "literally" from your vernacular: it adds literally nothing, and debit points when plain wrong).
https://t100triathlon.com/pro-racing/ and pointer over "Grand Final"
As far as its venue, in the PTN pod Renouf said " grand final . . . the final stage in the Middle East". Dubai early November, then . . . and it isn't going to be in Israel or on the Red Sea. Neom? (not a venue to visit!) Wordle? A proven venue and a city with water?

"With 8 races in the 2024 T100 season, the sum of each athlete’s 4 best point-scoring performances over the T100 season will be crowned the first-ever T100 World Champion. For those athletes who are also racing the Paris 2024 Olympic Games, the minimum number of races required is 3 plus the T100 Grand Final."
Contract for 5 plus the GF unless racing in Paris in which case 3+GF.
Purse for each race is $250k.
Besides the T100 World Championship crown there's a $2M end-of-series payout on the line and a relatively closely aligned $2M EoY PTO ranking bonus.
Lucrative months to be a pro. Look after your bodies, people: need to be 'still' racing in November.

Sam mentioned on the Pro Tri News pod they are still working through the commentating crews and it likely won't be the same folks for every race. He said they are interested in trying out some recently or soon to be retired pros so I imagine we'll be hearing from Seb and Jan this year, which is great news.

Dallas was a three year deal and they didn't fulfill the second and third year. So term length ends up not being THAT relevant. This will be a huge test for them.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

The women's field is amazing. By my count, the only woman in the top 16 that is not doing the T100 is Sarah True (16). Maybe True is too busy with school and kids.

One question I have is how will someone who was left off the original list work their way onto it next year? Presumably someone like Ellie Salthouse, Sarah Perez Sala, or Jackie Hering could have a good year and crack the top 20, but can they earn enough points if they're not doing PTO events?

Every time I hear "TBA"

Its my understanding that Ironman events are ranked with a couple others. So they would have to do very well in those I suppose, maybe a wild card here and there too..

But really, who on that list would they beat anyway at the 100k distance? The odd woman out for sure, but they will do much better in the ironman series financially. And as long as it continues, why would they even care much about PTO rankings, as long as they are crushing the ironman series? This is a blessing to ladies like that, carves out virtually all the top competition in a lot of the races they will be doing. Probably make more money than many on that list too, and that is what the pro scorecard is at the end of the year anyway...

Sanders is off the list - though he was expected to lean IM. Ditto with Skipper.

The one that strikes me as odd is Sam Long - he's never really excelled at this distance/format, so I would have expected him to go for the IM purse.

The new IM CEO has certainly got his work cut out.

I feel a bit sorry for Nice….this years ladies race could be a flop, they don’t deserve that.

There’s obviously a question mark over the long term sustainability of PTO but for now it’s a great time to be a fan (and obviously fantastic for the athletes).

I still think most of the women will show up at Nice, probably do 6 T100 races and 2 IM. It will be a long season for many of them and really depends if they can go through 10 months without any injuries as any minor niggles could mean sitting out one race and that would mean no WC

this has probably been clarified elsewhere, but if someone could just help me understand -

are these listed athletes for T100 contractually prohibited from participating in IM branded events? Or, rather, is it that they just have to fulfill the 5 out of 6 + grand final requirement for T100 tour, and the implicit aspect of that is these athletes probably won't choose to race any additional events since their calendar is full?

I think it’s manageable if one doesn’t get injured and gets a WC slot on their first attempt (so no flats)

Somewhat agree with you now, little flexibility especially if there are injuries or something goes wrong in a (IM) race that ruins WC qualifications

I dunno about Sam Long, 13 wins in 70.3s (IM - mostly - and Challenge branded), #2 in 70.3 WC St. George plus a #2 and two #5s in the 100k isn’t so bad? Hasn’t won a 140.6 since 2021. Just 2 wins and #3 in those, and not for lack of trying.

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"FTP is a bit 2015, don't you think?" - Gustav Iden

I originally asked ....So what did I miss in the story? How do PTO and Epstein's co. relate? Then went and googled. Had no idea PTO was the $$ behind Zuma Foundation. And here I thought it was being returned to a local race.

Given the council's reaction to the course, elimination of the Oly, etc. i find it hard that they'd approve an even longer race at that venue

100k is very similar to 70.3 & Sam has had much more success at 70.3 than he has at 140.6

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Pink? Maybe. Maybe not. You decide.

They can do any race in the world as long as they fulfil their T100 contract obligations

It's Roth I feel a bit sorry for. There are two top WPro athletes I can see racing:
Langridge and LCB (just doing the one long distance with no T100 race close and no requirement to validate (an IM) to secure her AQ IMWC slot.
I reckon that apart from LCB, 5 (of the top 7 at Kona) will be there to race Nice (Haug, Ryf, Sodaro, Philipp, Matthews) if fit. IMWC(WPro) was 'completely stacked': 2024 only a little less. And think LCB not risking it is a smart move.
A contracted athlete (and they all are) has to race 5 plus the GF. So they can drop Ibiza or race it as a warm down (if body lets them). Knibb's participation is not dependent on this: her challenge is to validate her IMWC AQ (assume with two 70.3s) by 19 Aug.

Its 5 out of 7 plus the Grand Finale.

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Pink? Maybe. Maybe not. You decide.

So I was trying to figure out the Cali race location/date. I thought about the USAT Legacy event that will end up being the LA Games Olympic venue in Long Beach....but that's 1 week prior to London's race date (July). So I'm curious what site is going to be the June Cali race venue.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

I was wondering about the CA location too. Protrinews has the dates as June 8-9 instead of TBA on PTO. Unless they make a new race, that could mean Escape from Alcatraz! If they are going for picturesque and iconic locations, can't think of a much better race. Although I don't envy the person who has to deal with the red tape.

Now that would be epic. Bringing Alcatraz back to the top of pro sport would be amazing.

Sam seemed to let slip on the podcast that the California date was in SoCal in June.

Oof, that would be a lot of horrible laps to get to 100K

Reading the ST front page....listening to the PTN pod w/ SR now.

Interesting to read about the finances of the races, makes sense financially the prize pool was shrunk with the additional "pto contracts":

Each race will feature a $250,000 prize pool, with $25,000 to the winner, $16,000 for second, and $12,000 for third. The T100 Triathlon World Champion, awarded based on points totals at the end of the year, will win $210,000 out of a $2 million prize pool. Between the cash prize pool and athlete contracts, more than $7 million will be awarded in compensation in 2024.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Altho looking at Miami venue, looks like they run a 100K event next to an established event, so not all races are 100K. I guess?

I still think "70.3" sucks as a brand.
Using an imperial measurement for distance when the majority of the world used metric shows how USA-centric the Ironman org is.

T100 is better branding and a better distance.

The T100 races are pm Saturday. The 'Miami Distance' race on Sunday is 1600m/48km/13km.

No Australia race? Not many in Europe?
Seems a bit of a shame.

They would like to get to 10 races so very likely there will Oceania and mainland Europe races in 2025.

I'm guessing August is reserved for when the Edmonton race can finally return in 2026 or 2027.

What does the age group pricing of world have to do with the pto ?

You do understand Ironman is a race / event organizer and pto is a professional triathlete race product.

They are separate athletes choose money, humans choose money have you been familiar with humans the last 1000 years.

Lionel is a good example he was super pissed at Ironman post 70.3 worlds until he realized it is now the hand that feeds him.

These athletes have to take his money while it is here, in 10 years there maybe a few they say I should have focused on world x or Ironman distance but this gets them paid.

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Technique will always last longer then energy production. Improve biomechanics, improve performance.
http://Www.anthonytoth.ca, triathletetoth@twitter

Cool, i think the 100K distance is killer.

If they were playing it right for the grand final put it in Australia then a lot of pros would be able to go right to 70.3 worlds

It may help Ironmans final but also if pto is paying for travel it would help their contracted athletes so much to cover that travel expense.

This is giving us great races on paper to start, how long till we get bored of the same faces and format ??

It’s itu but longer / no drafting . We have seen this product.

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Technique will always last longer then energy production. Improve biomechanics, improve performance.
http://Www.anthonytoth.ca, triathletetoth@twitter

The Grand Final in combination with the Noosa Triathlon Festival would have been dope (and everything PTO wants out of its events).

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The Noosa Tri is owned by Ironman so that 'aint going to happen.

Lol no it is not. Ironman 70.3 carries a lot of cache.

Try explaining PTO T100 in Partnership with World Triathlon instead of "Ironman".
____

Also incredibly disappointed that we're seeing really old recycles like Brownlee and Gomez on this, if those guys get the eyeballs, that's just as bad as Triathlon's average racing age creeping towards 50.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

I have a totally opposite view from you on this (and many other things :-)). Was really hoping to see Javier and Alistair racing the new blood. And Alistair is not that old (in real age, maybe older in triathlon/wear and tear age). And I think (hope?) that they will have a strong influence on the narratives and excitement coming out of this first year of the series. For one, they are almost guaranteed to feature in every race prominently (being among the best swimmers). And there run potential (potential being used due to past injuries, not because they haven't shown what they can do) is second to none too, except maybe Hayden Wilde if he shows up as a wildcard post-Olympics.

I was excited to see those two on the list!

Weird. I'm most excited about Brownlee. I just hope he doesn't injure himself again. I'm also most excited to see him racing more frequently in this T100 format.

I think it was just the StoBro grasping at straws to find anything negative in today's news.

Looking at the comp structure a few of those athletes that are unlikely to get in the top ~10 probably have a strong incentive to get the contract $, show up at the PTO races as paid training sessions (still some prize money even if dead lasts) and then try to perform on the less competitive ironman circuit if the goal is to maximize their gains.

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It seems that RvB agrees with you...

American triathlon star combining PTO Tour and IRONMAN racing (tri247.com)
"Moving on to his racing goals, the American star underlined that whilst Kona is his primary goal, he believes racing the PTO Tour throughout the year will increase his chances of success come October.

I think it will be good for me to not solely focus on full distance and the PTO will help me with that VO2 max and high velocity, but it’s also still long enough that you need to be efficient and it’s a comparable sport.

It’s not like Super League, where it is a completely different energy system and so I think it will help whilst still having Roth to get that IRONMAN prep in June. I think it is the perfect plan with two solid full distance races and then the PTO Tour.”

The "70.3" branding that's been around for something like 12-13 years and we just learned about the T100 branding today.
You must be very intelligent to figure out that the T100 brand isn't well known yet. Maybe apply for Mensa.

Sounds like a sensible approach for many pros. Sucks from an audience perspective if T100 is just long training sessions.

True, but nobody else is going to the Olympics in that male list so it's weird it's only him.

i personally think the fields are too small with 20 people what what i really dont get is that they dont allow more than 20 people for the grand final i think they should allow wild card people in that had shown an impact in the race when they had a wildcard. i mean there is some top athletes
they recognise that their field size is not fixed for ever so why not play around with it a bit
i get they want the narative that people can follow , at the same time singapore was for most perople the most boring race and i guess it was because the filed was too small

Target is clearly 20, but I don't think they'll limit themselves to 20 on the start list, if they have a superstar willing to join as #21. It might be KB, might be Gustav, might be Hayden etc. Additionally, they might even give 6 wild cards on top 16 fixed slots, just in case somebody feels sick on race morning. So it could be anything between 18-22.

I feel 20 is about right as long as the top ones are there. They used to have a field of 40 but vast majority didn’t stand a chance or feature
I have the feeling it will be the same with 20,

I am disappointed they don't have a race in up state NY or in Eastern Canada (which age group Americans in North East and Easterners Canadians could get to by car). Maybe it is their late timing. Maybe next year!

Did I misunderstand the start list.

I was under the impression that the "Hot Shots" are only on the start line if one or more of the first 16 are not racing....

I guess you could assume every race will have at least one of the first 16 pass on it........

So is the Townsville long distance not going to be the WT Long Distance Championships? T100 could have incorporated it somehow. It is two weeks after Olympics and before the next T100.

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Yeah,it is totally unfair that the USA only got three races.....Those PTO bastards!!!

That's a good call, especially for the guys not really in the T5 type of "on air" racing action. Sam I believe described the "contracts" as essentially marketing jobs, so I think the athletes will have to show up to get paid over the year, but I do wonder how "motivated" the athletes middle of pack will be. Like are they all in on it, or will they do what so many are theorizing.....how to figure out how to race both series to get the most out of it; and will that eventually "hurt" the T100 brand. Years ago, IM implemented a rule that in order to get paid you had to be within X position. The pro's sorta created run arounds of it that made it sorta a mockery of the rule- I beleve 1 race leader stopped 100m and ate a bag of chips so the time gaps let everyone get paid, maybe even did the "winners" interview before actually finishing if I recall correctly. IM I believe took that rule away a year or 2 later. So that'll be an interesting angle to follow.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

well people like tom bisop mika nood mathew marquard jan stratman kyle smith in one way or another would feature. bishop and nood have led pto races solo and i would not put it beyond mika nood to win one of them 2024. i do like it that they have alistair as he is a disrupeter for swim and bike and gomes makes sense for the spanish market

sara perez is an athelte that is always intersting in the female race lucy buckingham leads out a lot of races sarah true, caroline pohle and lisa norden would all be interesting athetles.
and i guess you would like to have somebody from brazil . big triathlon tv market , like pam olivera that has a top swim and to increase the tv market and while i don not want to limit numbers from countries like in itu i guess it would be good to have an asian athlete in the series

The Ironman 70.3 brand was launched in 2005, so this is the 20th year of the brand.

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Pink? Maybe. Maybe not. You decide.

Cool. It still sucks.

What would you call it?

WTCS is also a downground from WTS.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

i still call them half ironman ....

it'll always be ITU to me

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

I dunno, I'm not in marketing.

I felt that calling it "Ironman 70.3" and "Ironman 5150" started the devaluation of "Ironman" from the classic long distance race.

LCB spills the beans probably inadvertently. Grand Final will be in November in “the Middle East”.

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-Of course it's 'effing hard, it's IRONMAN!
Team ZOOT
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I think they also said it in the Sam Renouf interview on PTN

Why did you reply to me?

LCB said in her video that she’s not defending her Kona title and may only do a couple of 70.3s because her “heart and her passion” is in the T100. If you’re IM, that has to hurt. The extremely popular reigning Kona champ basically says your races are an afterthought.

But she also said she will defend in Kona & that is the top of the triathlon world. She was doing a promo for the T100 series. You don't think the script of that segment was influenced in any way?

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Pink? Maybe. Maybe not. You decide.

She's just like every other Ironman AG bucket lister. One and done vs Won and done.

Well, she did get the tattoo.......................

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Pink? Maybe. Maybe not. You decide.

I think someone like Salthouse, Herring, or Sala would want to crack the top 20 or top 16, if for no other reason than the guaranteed money of a PTO contract. The question of how someone not invited to the T100 can gain ranking points is also relevant for those currently in the top 16. If someone has an injury-plagued season, or an off year, they might drop off the list. How do you work your way back on? I assume you get points for IM-branded races, but I’m not sure of the relative weight vs. T100 races, so I’m unclear as to how hard it is to climb into the top 16 if you’re currently on the outside looking in.

Sure, i imagine it was somewhat scripted. But if I’m Ironman, what difference does that make? It still sucks. The reigning champion does not consider the upcoming world championship
a real world championship and won’t even commit to the 70.3 WC. That’s just a terrible look for IM.

You know what's not a terrible look for Ironman? In one of the shots in that video, you can clearly see the Mdot tattoo on her ankle!!

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Pink? Maybe. Maybe not. You decide.

I think someone like Salthouse, Herring, or Sala would want to crack the top 20 or top 16, if for no other reason than the guaranteed money of a PTO contract//

Of course they would like that, but if you look at the list, they are not top 16 out of that group. They are part of a group just on the outside and will have to really make a jump in race placings to get that coveted spot. Like you, I dont know the weight of Ironman racing, but have to imagine placing on the podium of the big races will be worth a lot of points, certainly more than perhaps a 10th at a PTO event.


So this is their chance, most of the top ladies sitting out the ironman series, so they can really show their stuff. If not, then they dont belong there anyway. Yes there will be more points in the PTO races overall, but of course the best racers will also be there too. I suppose we will see pretty soon, be interesting to see what an Oceanside win points wise will be compared to say a top 5 in that first PTO race. In my mind it should be about par with 4th or 5th there, but who knows at this point. Does anyone know how this years rankings are going to be tabulated? Is quality of field gonna be a factor?

The PTO still isn’t sure how they are going to handle pro participation from year to year. They recognize that having a closed league is not desirable but they haven’t figured out how pros will be able to work their way in when there’s 0 chance anyone not on the T100 tour will have enough points to qualify.

Actually yesterday on the T100 website the Final was written as Oman Finals, i can't find it today so not sure if it was a mistake or not

Looking at the starting list there are very few weaker swimmers only Long and Chevalier will team to race from the back, i hope that the coverage manages to show that part of the race which can make for the long bike part which can be boring if only the front of the race is shown

Drawing on Renouf's interview on PTN and the shared 'explainer'
20 athletes are contracted. 16 auto-qualified for a contract offer based on PTO Ranking: a first 10 earlier (hence Lawrence Kanute and Neumann) and the balance (of 16) in December, rolling down as necessary. Then they offered 4 contracts to other notables (various criteria). Watkinson, Spivey, Duffy and Byram took those 'Hot Shot' contracts. All to race 5 (or 3 if racing Paris) plus GF.

Start number limited to 20, so 140 starts plus GF. Contracted athletes at minimum will fill 94: assumes Knibb, Duffy and Spivey race Olympics (I really hopes she gets the USA nod: deserves it and to reverse poke Luis (who won't)).

This means there'll be maximum 46 'wildcard' slots (likely less as several will do 6 of 7 and a few 7 of 7) so say 28 slots. Divided between 7 races that's average 4 wild cards per race (will be few in Miami and plenty in emetic Singapore). A chance for a Sanders cameo in the southern CA race in June?

By mid November the scores (best 3 or ?4 results) will be on the doors. All those contracted will have a Grand Final start slot. In addition, every athlete who has benefited from one or more wildcards and scored more points than the last contracted athlete will be given a start. GF scores more. World Champion and T100 Series ranking determined on an athlete's best 4 scores.
https://t100triathlon.com/pro-series-explainer/
PTO Rankings: All races will be Diamond (only other is the IMWC). PTO Rankings remain best 3 on a rolling 365 day basis with EoY bonuses paid on EoY rankings. Clearly it's easier to score highly on the top races in a field where the top athletes (well at least 5) start. Miami WPro SOF looks to be as much as 95.9 which means that #3 will get you about 96.5 (Knibb 2023 score ranked #3 was 96.3) and an athlete in #10 (10 minutes down) would score about 85 (cf Lawrence 2023 on 83 and was ranked #22).

Inevitably that leads to an echo chamber of not being able to really crack that top 16 for the following year, unless you win IMWC and some gold tier events.

It’s where the PTO both being a race production company and a ranking/advocacy group don’t align on mission.

That said, looking forward to what they present for a product this year. The NASCAR team is contracted for the CLASH based broadcast, which is a good way to start the year.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

That’s good re: nascar

That 2020 Daytona race remains the high water mark in my head for triathlon coverage quality

I'd really like for them to fully shed their "advocacy group" nonsense. Either jettison the "athlete board" or call it an "advisory group". But I'm sure the people behind that have a lot of ego.



I call it the ITU on this board keep telling me NOOOO, it is WORLD TRIATHLON...World Triathlon is a DBA.


This sport and its athletes love blood money. Mortiz Events to join the sportswash!

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

The aspiration, need even, to ensure this is not a closed league is an aspect that the PTO has to finesse and have various mechanisms to consider. Promotion/relegation will become a key aspect of the 'story' later in the season: they need to take actions as early as Singapore.
It seems to me this has not been modelled with sufficient care. One of the aspects of the (2024 contract) 'offer' to athletes was the imperative to get on board or you may not be able to next year (as I argued in the 2023 PTO thread) - almost a 2+ year deal.
(From https://t100triathlon.com/pro-series-explainer/ and Renouf's PTN pod answers)
Make or break for 2025
". . . there’s also the opportunity for athletes to earn their T100 contract for 2025 – or the jeopardy of losing their place in the series if they don’t perform. The top 10 athletes in the T100 standings at the end of the season will guarantee . . a contract in 2025, whether their (sic) a 2024 contracted athlete, Hot Shot or a Wildcard. ["Hot Shots are contracted athletes"]

"The next 6 contracted athletes for 2025 will be decided through PTO World Rankings, the contracts going to the 6 highest-ranked athletes who haven’t already earned a contract regardless of whether they’ve raced T100 or not. The final 4 contracts will go to Hot Shot athletes."

The issue is the PTO ranking points that will be scored by

• athletes outside the 2024 EoY top 10 T100 Tour athletes
• versus
• points scored by an athlete of similar calibre but not contracted this year

Note: The latter will be those currently ranked below #17 or draft illegal parvenus (ex-ITU, pre- or post-Paris) https://stats.protriathletes.org/rankings/women and very likely have raced one or two T100 races with wildcards

To ensure promotion opportunity (and concomitant relegation) PTO could:

• Revise the conditions for contract renewal - for example changing it to 8 assured renewals. But in practice, #10 on the T100 list (on 1 Dec) will surely be in the top 15 of the PTO rankings at EoY.
• Grade the first seven races as Platinum as opposed to Diamond and keep only the Grand Final as Diamond (along with the IMWC). Renouf answered/argued that the T100 races completely deserved 'Diamond' status as, in the round, each offers way more than the $500k threshold in remuneration (overall 'compensation' for the T100 Tour is >$7M: contracts plus race prize purse plus T100 Series winnings)
• Ensure that the wild cards are offered with this aspect in mind: enabling athletes to challenge the top tier and, by excellent performance, gain T100 points (chance of making the GF) and high PTO Rankings points (only need 3 scores in the year) The challenge will be that there'll be very few wild cards (for WPro) in Las Vegas or Dubai as all contracted athletes will race.
• Increase the number of starters in the Grand Final (to allow good PTO Rankings points to be scored and keep those athletes 'in the story').
  

PTO Rankings points:

• The SOF of the T100 races will be higher than every other race (even the IMWC).
• Clearly it's easier to score highly on the top races in a field where the top athletes (at least 5) start.
• All T100 races are shown as Diamond (only other is the IMWC). PTO Rankings remain best 3 on a rolling 365 day basis.
• The 70.3WC is Platinum, as is Roth and the WT designated LDWC (Townsville I think).
• The top IMs and some 70.3s (roughly the IMs and some 70.3s in the IM Series) will be Gold. But the SOF of, for example, IM Texas (even though that race is going to be stacked) will be (my estimate) 4 lower than T100 Miami so points lower.
• In December PTO will be faced with the dilemma of needing to get 2025 contracts out and get them accepted but yet wait (I hope) for the Taupō results/PTO Ranking scores to inform those final 6 AQ contract recipients.
• The 4 'Hot Shot' discretionary picks may offer them enough flexibility.
  
• PTO will want to maintain their grip on the narrative and be somewhat irritated to find Taupō being the focus of the promotion /relegation 'story'; because it surely will be: the SOF will be high with all the top athletes extending their season (if bodies still in one piece) to travel early December from the 'Middle East' (GF venue) down to Auckland.
  

LCB doing a bit of clean up on aisle 3 on her IG today.

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-Of course it's 'effing hard, it's IRONMAN!
Team ZOOT
ZOOT, QR, Garmin, HED Wheels, Zealios, FormSwim, Precision Hydration, Rudy Project

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Only because the usual internet trolls have decided to become outraged at her preference not to race Nice this year.

You can't win when you are in the public eye and people attach themselves personally to brands (or athletes/celebrities) to the extent that they take it personally when you don't do or say what they think you should.

Except Sam has mentioned models such as the relegation model in other sports. He is no dummy. He will find a way to get fresh blood into the system.

The PTN interview was really well done. The questions were sharp and the answers seemed sincere and no BS.

As for missions not aligning, when there is no infrastructure accessible to you, and you want to build, sometimes you need to create the infrastructure that's missing. Good thing they have deep pockets.

Gotta ask the missus for permission to join the party...

Sam is really good at spending other folks money.

The relegation model of field sports isn't applicable to this as triathlon isn't deep enough to support multiple tour levels like Golf is. Nor is it popular enough to sustain a professional only event.

How many of those have existed? Island House, Colline Cup, and Couples Championship?

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

Frankly, I think it'd be *great* if World Triathlon took over the rankings aspect, with PTO/T100 and other race producers focused on the commercial interest. Not too far off from the FIA/F1 arrangement.

Although that Andretti debacle shows that model isn't perfect, either.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

Agreed PTO could hand it off the WT if there is belief they won't F it up.

Give PTO credit, they created a ranking system that works. They wrote down the rules, everyone knew the rules and they executed. They went from 0 to something pretty good in 2 years

Yes, execution can now be handed off.

Then again, they paid for this all, should they not have some strong influence on it moving forward ?

There is a simple way for IM events to get higher status : pay more. Super simple.

World tour cycling has 18 teams. Every cycle, bottom 2 teams get relegated, 2 teams come up. Top teams in the division below get invites to the big league.

Super simple.


They did simple math in that podcast
8 races x 20 spots = 160 spots
6 commited races x 20 = 120 committed starts

this leaves 40 spots for wildcards to gather precious points

Go to 10 races, more wildcards available
Add a few starters (say 25), more wildcards available
Use a simple relegation
Use discretionary picks
.....
It's ain't brain surgery


As for Sam spending others money, I am sure a person with your financial industry saviness acknowledges that every CEO of a VC funded company is really good at spending other people's money.

Bet he will join. As a commentator of course.

I think that, especially with World Triathlon, they'll want to eliminate any sense of bias in the criteria, etc. But that's spitballing.

As for the IM events...well, the easy solution is what I think is coming next -- the concentration of all prize purses to those events that count in the Pro Series.

What still remains to be seen is how industry sponsors respond. Many of them have traditionally paid either less money, or no bonus money, to non-IM events unless it got specifically negotiated in. My guess is that it'll change following this year, but then again, our industry isn't exactly known for moving *that* fast when it comes to the business end of things.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

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The way the PTO have continued to post "Jan Frodeno moments" on Facebook,I wouldn't have been at all surprised to see him invited to make a celebrity appearance on the start line of a couple of the races.
Would be good to hear him commentate for a few of them though.

i guess the one issue here is pto pays for the yearly bonuses so i guess one could argue they should also be in charge or at least somewhat at charge .

personally i want itu to stay out of this as much as possible as it would likely get too political , at the same time i also agree pto should not be totally in charge of it. difficult to find a good way here ... maybe we still need a proper pro triathlon organisation to be involved in the world ranking procedure .

IMO, the PTO ranking is close to perfect. They've developed it from the ground, it's theirs to manage.

How do you know it is internet trolls, as opposed to say Ironman itself? If I worked for IM, I certainly would have wanted to give her a call and let her know that her video was not well received or good for Nice. It's also quite possible that she decided to issue the clarification herself. I imagine LCB has positive feelings toward IM and is grateful for the opportunities it has provided. She's particularly invested in the success of women's WC and does not wish to harm IM, Nice, or women's racing. Her decision to do the T100 was, just like everyone else's, a business one. When she realized that the manner in which she presented her decision was potentially harmful to Nice, she felt regret and issued a follow-up statement. Maybe the 'trolls' had little to do with it.

I think this is because so many normal citizens / triathletes can not keep up with the different race companies etc if you read the comments on stuff people don’t get it .

They think if you sign with one you can’t do the other , etc .

I mean if someone in the pto stays injured for the first couple of races or they see they are way back and can’t crack the top ten they could change their focus and go towards a nice world championship. They could just race pto at a lower effort to make the 6 races required for the $$$$.

I am worried with all this racing we the viewer are about to see lesser quality racing and performances the next x years while it continues.

Ten years ago we knew you all had to be ready in x date in kona , that’s the race one and only.

Now we have a ton of races and then t100 will have guys and gals that would win Roth but are now 10 th in California t100.

Instead of one Super Bowl we now have a crap load of regular season and then a bunch of playoffs called championships.

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Technique will always last longer then energy production. Improve biomechanics, improve performance.
http://Www.anthonytoth.ca, triathletetoth@twitter

i would agree with you that it was very good 2023. at the same time i think what some people here suggest is that there is of course some risk to give their races too many points and the atheltes that have the most votes are by and large the ones in the pto series so there could be some bias by those atheltes. iam not saying this is the case. but i can see where people are coming from that suggest that this could be the case.

Can you ask these questions to Sam next time or maybe they have been answered?

How do they plan to make money ?

If they don’t want commercials during their broadcast how do they make money ?

If they don’t hold their own age group races how do they grow a fan base?

Not to ask him but he said the schedule was not to cross dates with other races but

I believe these are all pretty close together

Singapore- Texas
California - Roth
London - Olympics
Ibiza - nice
Vegas- kona
Grand final - 70.3 worlds
( I know there are only so many weeks a year so they will always be kind of close? )

What a coincidence but what a gamble you are going to compete every event with social media and content overload ? If you don’t win that the growth would end right there in year 1 .

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Technique will always last longer then energy production. Improve biomechanics, improve performance.
http://Www.anthonytoth.ca, triathletetoth@twitter

Work in field sports. Fortunately or unfortunately I know a lot about spending other peoples money as well as building schedules. And also in the start up space.

At the end of the day, if Moritz and his investors are ok with bleeding money like this and Renouf can show a tangible path to cost neutral and then profit. PTO stays alive. But remember, PTO has an executive chairman whom they pay. Their entire board might be paid.

They have a larger staff than the one I currently work on. So their overhead has to be incredible.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

at the same time the pto announcement in the first 48 hours got slightly more clicks here than the new ironman ceo annoncement in the firt 48 hours , and i guess in a way while they bleed a lot of money they also attract a lot of attention against the leader of the market , they are the first organisation that really is passing ironman in entanglement and of course ST is not triathlon but if you cant mange it on st you have no chance at all . so the question here is should they spend less and get less engagment or does it work better to go all in. and i guess anybody that thinks that there is sustainable pto model would likely suggest go all in.
IE the model is going to work or not but i guess by spending less they does not increase the chances to work and i guess they have longer staying power than most would have thought at the beginning.
i mean it was you who said no way will they get 8 races this year , they did. the athletes know the locations.
and i guess we cant deny that ironman is feeling the pressure right now despit having the more sustainable model they are under pressure. and i guess from the triathlon side ironman does not increase its resale value at the moment. they dont control the narrative of triathlon at the moment. they will likely win but right know they are not controlling it. and i guess by starting the ironman pro series maybe ironman shows they are not anymore 100 percent confident that pto will fold quickly.

The T100 will make a great replacement for Ironman 70.3 as a race, if they can get the course design interesting for an age grouper. If it's just a bunch of laps, no chance.

But T100 will always struggle in the broader culture to be as impact full as Ironman. I can absolutely see T100 upsetting local age races that aren't Ironman. I wonder how long if ever the T100 would take to mean anything at the water cooler conversation on Monday that doesn't end up with, "it's like an Ironman" shorthand. That alone means most of those personal life goal sign-up peoples that dream of "Ironman" will never even learn of T100 until they've already done several Ironmans. So best case scenario when it comes to AG races T100 is vying for a small share of the customers lifespan of a declining market? How many T100 racers will there be? Clash Miami had what, 500 racers? Can T100 get to 2000? Do they even want that many?

The idea of a 100k race is pretty cool and it's just *that* much easier than a half IM that I can see customers being happier with it. I've already marked Vegas on the calendar. I do wish PTO success, despite my various criticisms or skeptical takes. I just hope they hurry up and buy Ironman already. Ironman 100 makes a better name and then all those 70.3 medals become "collectors items" hah.

As you say, there's only so many weeks in a year. I am surprised there aren't T100 races in mid May nor in late August/early September: seem like gaps: maybe a race fell through.
As to your list (and WPro only)

• Singapore - Texas: I suggest that only half a dozen contracted athletes will want to race Texas to qualify or validate for Nice and to stay in the IM Series convo: they'll miss Singapore (as one of their two misses and avoid stomach issues).
• California - Roth: 8 June v 7 July - not a clash. How many will actually want to do Roth anyway? I guess an IM capable athlete who decides not to race Nice could do Roth as their one LD of the season: in which case miss the Pacific Ocean (or a harbour on the west coast).
• London - Olympics: No Olympic athlete is going to be racing London but they only have to race 3 races plus GF, so not an issue.
• Nice - Ibiza: For the men not an issue; for the IM capable women (6? and ?still hanging in there for the IM Series) either a miss or a warm down: fulfilling contractual obligation but not expecting it to be one of their scoring T100 three.
• Las Vegas-Kona: For the women not an issue: for the IMWC headed men (max 8): one of their two misses. Plenty of post Olympics hopefuls to fill the wildcard spots (though will clash with Superleague (assumed)).
• T100 Grand Final - 70.3WC Taupō: 15 days apart. Everyone stir crazy by then and either injured or desperate to have some weeks easy.

You did a nice job illustrating how what could be perceived as a head to head aggressive move to preempt major competing events was mostly a giant nothing burger.

Not just which athletes choose what to race but more putting attention on the product. Are they here to compete with Ironman ( also itu o guess and super league ) which is race company or to show pro racing. I can’t figure it out as they change back and forth like the wind .

And I don’t get how internet clicks make them money ?

Theirs races are limited space and so few to generate the money to run the t100 prize purse?

They need major sponsors but then they would have commercials and product placement which we know the views hates as witnessed with Ironman .

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Technique will always last longer then energy production. Improve biomechanics, improve performance.
http://Www.anthonytoth.ca, triathletetoth@twitter

I've never heard Sam say anything about commercials during broadcasts, but he has said over and over the intention is to sell the rights to the T100 series to a TV/streaming partner. They don't care about age group racing, but they do care about crowds so having an AG race helps to get bodies on the sidelines of the pro races.

I'm fine with ads/sponsors (especially if the broadcast is free) as long as they don't inundate us with cheesy sayings like the "Muarten Move".............................

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Pink? Maybe. Maybe not. You decide.

If the sponsor gives you money to say x you say x that’s how sponsorship works , have you seen people pretending to drink ag1 and saying it’s good .

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Technique will always last longer then energy production. Improve biomechanics, improve performance.
http://Www.anthonytoth.ca, triathletetoth@twitter

Interesting, I don’t get the crowd thing as we know kona has barley a crowd and know one cares.

South Africa 70.3 worlds 2018 I never noticed if there was a crowd but it was an epic race and had great footage. I remember that

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Technique will always last longer then energy production. Improve biomechanics, improve performance.
http://Www.anthonytoth.ca, triathletetoth@twitter

Global broadcast:

• Shown on TV in over 120 territories
• Watch on Eurosport and Discovery+ in Europe
• Watch on PTO+ and YouTube (free) in the rest of the world

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Wow,that is some serious imagination you have going on there. I prefer to go to the source and find something I can quote.
From her IG
"
🚨Statement🚨

Regarding my comments about my race selection this year, see full statement in the image slides…

** In the past two days, I’ve gotten some inappropriate messages. Feel free to express your thoughts, but I ask that you remain civil **
10h .
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Immediately under that statement was Sam Longs message of support.
"Everyone these days is an arm chair quarterback. I’ve felt similar pressure and I’m not a World Champion. I can’t imagine all the thought that went into it but know that you made the right choice for YOU!"

I’m not saying internet trolls do not exist. What I’m saying is that it is likely her follow up statement reflects her genuine beliefs and desire to explain the switch to the T100 in a manner less damaging to IM rather than an attempt to appease trolls, who we all know can’t be appeased anyway.

To be fair to this, on the front page the IM CEO article doubles the number of views of the T100/PTO story.

Our forum skews more heavily towards the "pro geek" side of the equation which will be more interested in that T100 story. But from a general tri awareness...

...both are dwarfed by the USAT stories we ran.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

Yeah but most forum members don't read the front page, and I did say it's a different sub set, but it's a bit like with power meters forum members had them way before the front page reader had them and no more front page reader have them. So the forum tends to be ahead of times to come.

Hello, Dubai resident.
Not sure if someone has answered this one. I doubt it will be in Yas marina (F1 circuit) as it is in Abu Dhabi. Race announced in Dubai. We are pretty pleased about this as we had some issues with Dubai 70.3 that was cancelled last year and not announced this year.

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Tridad

Just wanted to chime in on the Andretti thing and F1 (deviating from Triathlon).
Scandalous, Andretti deserved their spot on the grid!! pretty pissed about that even though not an American or indycar fan.

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Tridad

Gotta say the PTO did an incredible job locking down most of the best men/women. They got almost every woman & just a handful of men opted out. Going to make the Ironman Pro Series & World Champs interesting this year. Seems like the women's race in Nice will be very watered down. Same for the men in Kona. Seems like more athletes are targeting 70.3 Worlds at the end of the year. The Pro Tri News podcast was insightful. I like that it's not closed shop & that they'll be transparent about contracts. But it does feel like it'll be hard to get into the rankings since you're not lining up for the biggest races. I also thought Sam made some weird comments about what would happen if somebody gets pregnant. He started talking about how they won't let athletes abuse their contracts. I don't think that's the right word here.

I feel like they could build in some upward mobility by increasing the fields from 20 to 25 to 30 over the next few years. Something like that could allow for some new athletes to break in. It's going to be a lot of fun watching these races this year.

Listening to a few podcasts on the subjects, it's very exciting time. I finally feel like non-draft is going to have the best racing the best consistently, something that LC has really struggled with. Of course now it's double the fun with T100 + IM Series. I do cringe at all the narratives of trying to "double up" as that to me is just a recipe for poor results and/or injuries. I think the Miami race will be very much Daytona 2.0 from a race standpoint + broadcast standpoint as it's going to be all central located within the speedway property. Very exciting times.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

I don't think anyone with half a brain would consider trying to have a top placement in both IM series and T100. But I think it's completely possible to commit to T100 plus race Kona/Nice (basically the season plan for Laidlow, Dietlev, RvB, Chevalier, Ryf, Haug, Philipp etc.).

So your half in half out on both series? Or your only "half in" on the paid contract so you can secretly focus on the IM pathway, so then your '25 PTO ranking/gurantee potentially suffers. This half brained idiot has got it. Thanks

Add up the races your looking at 6 PTO races to get the best score (which assume that's why they would take the contract). 1 IM or 2 70.3 qualifiers + then the world championships in said events of either 70.3 or IM. So they are looking at 9-10 races of "top" quality racing. Which is fantastic, and also a ton of "pressure". Which is what the WTCS has been like for years, every single race is a "world championship" quality event, so I just think this idea of hedging your bets on both series to maximize revenue/winning is going to be very very complicated.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

I think you misunderstood. Not only me but also the ranking system(s).

Regarding PTO / T100

• Athletes I've named will do at least 6 out of 8 T100 races. The remaining 2 out of 8 give them a bit of flexibility to either not show up or train through a race.
• In order to get the slot for '25 T100 you need to be either TOP10 in T100 at the end of the season or the remaining TOP6 in the PTO ranking (basically be TOP16; this includes all races, not only T100).
• Due to the characteristics of T100 100km races, you need shorter recovery time compared to full IM. This enables you to explore outside of T100.

Regarding Kona / Nice / IM Series

• In the same time, doing Kona / Nice doesn't mean doing IM series, not even half-in. It's a one-off race.
• Due to the characteristics of IM series (3 full IMs are required for best scoring), you won't have spare energy to explore anywhere else if you commit to it.

It's a one-off race.

--------

They took out validation for the winners of IM and 70.3 now? I thought they still had to "validate" to gain their entry to this years world championship?
(I've not misunderstood anything)

To race IM as a validation it's: 1 IM or 2 70.3's

To race 70.3 as validation its: 1 70.3

So to get the "full" PTO contract according to sources you must race the full schedule. If you do less, you get less money, if you do less you also lose opportunities to offset/place hold/block others. So you can race as little or as much as you want as those guranteed athletes. The more you race, obviously the more travel + racing is on your body. So if you race IM WC as a validated athlete you are doing a min of 2 IM's more or 2 70.3 + 1 IM more on top of whatever PTO series races you actually decide to do.

Obviously the ones who decide "all in" on PTO will have a better chance at contract for following year + most amount of end of season money success. So unless you just show up and win 3 pto races and scratch the rest, the top 10 are going to almost assuredly be the ones who are "all in" on PTO. The ones who can win 3 times and skip the rest will likely best be positioned to grab that next 6 spots. I dont know that anyone is going to win more than a few who then also do "outside" race series at a top level imo, thus you'll likely be forced to focus on PTO if you want that '25 contract and the end of year bonuses.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Gotta say the PTO did an incredible job locking down most of the best men/women. They got almost every woman & just a handful of men opted out.//

As much as I'm enjoying the banter of who is going to do what race, do we know about the contracts that got scooped up by the 40 athletes? From the original rumors it seemed $100k was going to be the top tier, I wonder how many and who got those? Did the wild cards like Ali, Gomez, Spivey get the big ones, or was there some 2nd/3rd tier ones? Just doing the math from the race prize money and the overall series bonus, it looks like there was 3 million for these contracts. So I'm thinking maybe 15 of them or so at the #100k, and then some sliding scale..Has anyone who got them spilled the beans as of yet??


And as to who is and is not doing both series, I think the season and how athletes are doing will dictate that. You might have a plan to just do your 6 PTO races, but what if you crash out, get sick, just have a horrible day? Then you will need to add on as the season goes to hold a high place there, and could impact some Ironman race you thought you could squeeze in. And as Brooks pointed out, folks have to validate too.


But the thing is that the P100 races should be super easy to recover from physically, not much more than an olympic and less than a half. Folks do that in a week all the time. What is hard to recover from is the travel and stress of so many A races, that is what will grind on folks. I also dont see anyone trying to win or even podium in both series. But certainly many will hope to place top 5 in PTO and then by default of just doing a couple/few ironman events very well, get a top 4 to 7th place there. It is still good money all around and completely doable for a lot of the athletes. Hell, aren't a bunch racing this upcoming weekend in a 70.3 already, one down before all the madness even starts...

I’d bet almost every single T100 contracted athlete does one of Olympics/Kona/Nice/Roth/Taupo. Trying to do anymore than that seems unwise, but Sam and the PTO seem to be expecting all the athletes to have a major goal outside the T100 tour.

Monty, sounds like the PTO will be transparent around the contacts so we should have details over the next few months. Sam said they didn’t want to lead with that info, but it won’t be kept secret.

Well the Olympic athletes have already been given an shorter contract demands, and I get it. If you are in the 70.3 or IM validation role, your set. You can race the PTO, train/jog 2 70.3's and that will NQ (or train/jog an IM to NQ/KQ)

So like Sam Laidlow, no shit he's going to race all the big boy events, because his KQ is pretty easy. Just "jog" 'an IM or "jog" 2 70.3.

But my point is still not that you can or can't do it. It's that the T100 series is going to be top level of racing almost assured. There are going to be handful of guys who automatically are "all in" on it, and thus those guys will almost have any advantage over others who try and max out their race schedule.

So my point isn't a matter of can it or can't it be done. Of course a handful of pro's are going to race as many events as they can. I'm just saying we now have 1 and now with the IM series, 2 high level LC events that you just "jogging through it" isn't going to help with your PTO ranking for '25.



Years ago when WTCS changed their scoring policy, they removed the 1 day "world championship" to a series scoring system. It irked guys like AB because he was such a great 1 day racer, and also because AB frankly quit racing the "full series" after like '13. He would show up handful of times and skip races even if healthy cus it served no real purpose. So the athletes who race a full PTO schedule and score their top scores and then offset/block others will have a much better success than anyone who thinks they can race the "minimum" races so they can then go race other opportunities. That's what I think will end up happening here. And the hook is the guranteed '25 contracts that only 10 get. So those spots will be very very valuable to race for.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Looking at this from the contracted athlete viewpoint (and mostly WPRO).

For the IM-incapable (or unwilling) athletes (latter LCB, likely Knibb and possibly Simmonds and Lee) not an issue: crack on, fit in a 70.3 (if not done already) and race Taupō if body allows.

The top IM capable lot (Haug, Philipp, Ryf, Sodaro, Matthews, Moench) are contenders for the IM Series. Is any non-T100 athlete in the frame? Name them (WPro)?

Brooks has pointed out that anyone wanting to race IMWC will have to race an IM, either to get a slot or to validate. So you may as well do Texas (6 WPRO and that excludes the validators).
And racing Taupō will not affect the March to November season other than being 'a bit tired' from the Grand Final. But everyone in the top 10 will be in the same boat: they'll all have raced the GF in the "Middle East".

Therefore you have these women who can expect IM Series scores from Texas, Nice and Taupo. They need to fit in another IM series IM (Hamburg or other) and a 70.3. Sorted! (Ha ha!) And just weave in T100 100km races (March, June, July, September, October, November (drop one and race two easy eg ibiza after Nice) and finish off with the GF (13 days after T100 Dubai, same region). Fly to Auckland and race Taupō.

Gruelling but doable. Athletes will set off on this track and then modify their aims as they fail to achieve results or suffer injury/DNFs. And with both lobes of brain functioning: it's a professional choice.

T100 might be settled two-thirds through the season (by Gentle in Knibb's absence) and the GF being a coronation parade. LCB may have something to say about that. Much will depend on the Miami result: Gentle seems to start off slowly and build. But Knibb will come to Miami (I'm guessing, and with Spivey, both to get one of their contracted 3 in the bank) well down the Paris prep track and firing on all cylinders. Then disappear till Ibiza.
But the IM Series will go down to the wire at Taupō and will be between those who have raced top 6 at Nice.
Exciting times.

With this new T100 race series and bonuses, I am assuming that this replaces the annual bonus payout to the top 50 ranked pro?

If so, seems all the cash is concentrated on the elite 20!

Not so. The end-of-year PTO bonuses are set to continue as normal (and apparently with the same amount in total). I have not seen a 2024 revision distribution announced so assume 'no change'.
Athletes not contracted to T100 can get a few excellent scores, if they're good enough, in particular by finishing well in the IMWC (Diamond), the 70.3WC, WT LDWC https://townsville.triathlon.org/...-distance-triathlon/ and Roth (all Platinum). The latter two will offer less points because the SOF is certain to be low. Gold tier events (eg all the IMs in the IM Series and a few of the 70.3s) also offer good scores as the SOF (well surely for Texas, Hamburg and Frankfurt) will be high; and NB an additional 5% bonus for the best (not IMWC) IM.
I assume the scoring protocol will remain the same, with an athlete's ranking points being the average of their best 3 events and the scoring system for each race based on several factors: tier of race, SOF, position and time.
https://www.protriathletes.org/...orld-ranking-system/
Clearly theT100 twenty are likely to fill many of the top 15: they have at least 4 (some 8 or more) Diamond races to take their best 3 from so they will take the lionesses' share of the PTO EoY bonus pool monies.
To note the ranking list in December 2024 will be used to determine who gets contracts #11-#16 for 2025 T100.
https://t100triathlon.com/pro-series-explainer/

SO they are going to pay out 7 million to the series folks, and then have a separate payout for the top 50 in the rankings too?

Do you know how those top 50 payouts will compare to the 2 million in series payouts will be??? I see the top in the series is $210k, so a not so subtle shout out to ironman and their 200k payout for top dogs...

"In addition to over $3M in athlete contracts, there will be $250k up for grabs at each T100 event ($125k per gender), totalling $2M over the 8-race T100 Triathlon World Tour, plus a huge end-of-season payout total of $2M paying down to 20th – with each T100 World Champion bagging an extra $210,000 for securing the top spot."
https://t100triathlon.com/pro-series-explainer/
The 'compensation' schedule for an athlete's EoY PTO Ranking has, as far as I can discover, not been announced, but (I'm relying on memory from various PTO interviews here) I think the intention is to carry that on. I can see the payouts being flattened, which might be to the benefit of the #11-#30 list and keep the #31-#50 sum the same. The PTO don't need to reward the T100 athletes more than 3 times (contract plus T100 prize purse plus T100 Series ranking bonus).
2023: https://www.trirating.com/...riathlon-money-list/

Ok, I thought you had said it "will" be going on this year, you just think so at the moment.

I only say this as my "feeling" is that the PTO series payouts is going to replace the old top 50 ones. It seems a bit redundant to pay twice for a ranking, being that most will come from their series rankings anyway. And the other end of that is, why pay out to Ironman series folks for their achievements outside of your races? I mean it is ok to give them rankings and all, you want the ones that rise to the top to be eligible to take a contract in your series once they have made a name for themselves. But paying them doesnt seem cost effective, at least as far as your brand and what you are trying to build goes...

Why would Olympic pathway athletes like Knibb and Spivey race the Miami event? Abu Dhabi WTCS is the same weekend in March (sprint & MR events) and Knibb is on record as saying she will race in Abu Dhabi.

You're right. They are very unlikely to race Miami (pity). I had thought it might be a chance to get' one in the bag' to satisfy their T100 contracted number of races. They can race Ibiza (Sep), Las Vegas (Oct) and Dubai (Nov). But it gives them no wriggle room if they are to satisfy their contracts (three plus GF). Will Spivey try to race Superleague again?

I personally like the fact that racers like Spivey are putting the Olympic race first, no matter how much money long course organizations throw at them.

(Paradoxically, I also like the fact that she has signed up. Most exciting name on the list for me).

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"FTP is a bit 2015, don't you think?" - Gustav Iden

Absolutely agree first bit. Same applies to Blummenfelt (and Iden, and Luis, and Wilde) saying 'no thanks' to the PTO (this (Olympic) year).
I fervently hope USAT give her that (deserved) second slot in the team (chance of any more US athletes AQing seems nil). Assuming completely fit again, you could not have a more reliable Leg 2 and even an accomplice for Knibb (and another?) front pack on the bike a few days earlier.
I hope that her signing the contract does not reduce her standing with the selectors: however her 2024 actions will make her primary objective crystal clear and USAT will have complete visibility.
Of course if she doesn't get the nod in May she can race T100 on the West Coast in June and London in July, and then pop over to watch her friends race Paris and cheer them on in the MTR.
Ibiza is a few days after the WTCS Final in Pontevedra (both Spain).
It will be interesting to see Spivey race in Ibiza: she'll have raced minimal/no TT. She will surely stay with LCB in the water but I shall guess not able to stay with her (or Knibb when/if she catches up) on the bike. Gentle will have some catching up to do for sure. Spivey v LCB starting the run clear would interesting: in WTCS Leeds (May 2021 pre-Tokyo) LCB was 23 seconds faster over 10km. After 80km in TT this September . . . All those coming across from Nice will be fatigued so it'll be between them (mentioned above) and an on-form Findlay.
https://wtcs.triathlon.org/...iathlon_leeds/452748

i'm with you on the payouts - it's a money-distribution system, for sure, but why specifically subsidize other series? also i've always figured that if the purpose was developing athletes and ensuring tight competition, paying out 100k year-end to athletes like lucy or jan or kristian is kind of a 'waste,' in the sense that they're already making lots of money. whereas 20k each to a handful of "nearly there" pros could really be a game changer and get them on to some big start lines.

here again with my sense that the PTO needs a really clarified purpose. if they're only an athlete's union, paying out year-end bonuses across the board makes more sense. if they're a promotional agency it makes some sense. if they're a racing series, it makes very little sense.

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____________________________________
https://lshtm.academia.edu/MikeCallaghan

http://howtobeswiss.blogspot.ch/

Yes it seems a small few will make all the money, is already this way but will be even more so. Everyone else is potentially locked out of the series and decent money for their careers now due to the skewed points system.if they are not in, it is going be extremely hard to get there.

 


Paula trolling a bit

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"FTP is a bit 2015, don't you think?" - Gustav Iden

Yes it seems a small few will make all the money, is already this way but will be even more so. Everyone else is potentially locked out of the series and decent money for their careers now due to the skewed points system//

This doesnt make any sense to me. There is a whole other group of pros that are going to make really great money from the new ironman series, literally as much as the PTO one. And then you have another mostly separate group making pretty good money racing the ITU circuit and getting national funding. Then there is another couple million in the super league series. And on top of all that, you have Roth and several other stand alone races pros can do to earn a living. It literally is the best time ever in our sport for the most pros to be able to not only make a living, but for many of the top earners, put money away and become self sufficient after triathlon..


All this talk of just a few are getting all the dollars is just nonsense, do folks expect athlete #1000 to be making 6 figures???

I think they are doing a little bit of hedging.

I mean they can't basically "cut off" anyone else but the 16-20 in the PTO series right now because well, there may be some better athletes out there. So I think the bulk of the money is going into the T100 series and then the end of year "bonuses" goes to anyone. But then again if you do most of T100 races and those are the "best" scoring races, then by default those athletes have an advantage over the IM series athletes in terms of schedule strength.

So I think it kinda allows for this to obviously be the T100 show but also some "relegation" ability as well.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

You know it's really funny as this has been done before; it's essentially LC's version of WTS/WTCS. Finally in long course racing the best will be competing against the best year round, something that ITU has been doing for years.

I think if any lessons are to be learned from ITU it is this.

1. Review your prize money every 2 or 3 years to increase with inflation. The WTCS prize money of $18k/$12k/$8k race - $30k/$22k/$16 GF and $80k/$55k/$38k Bonus pool, has more or less remained static for over 10 years. Brooks do you think this might be the kick up the arse for the ITU to review prize money to potentially stop guys like Yee and Wilde leaving?

2. Don't over reach on the number of races. The WTCS in 2015 was 10 races and athletes were not happy with the number of races, or the torturous travel due to the sequencing of the events. I think 7 or 8 events in total is the maximum for a sustainable race series.

3. Get venues that actually have a good age group weekend and have a triathlon culture that will make things pretty sustainable (I'm thinking Yokohama or Hamburg here). Otherwise these 3-5 year contracts wont be worth the paper they are written on.

4. Mix the bike courses up a bit. ITU world cup venues are so so much better than the actual premier race series. Let's reward the best cyclists not just the strongest cyclists.

1. I don't think WT has the funds to meet inflation even with the "successful" WTCS series. So I understand the lack of prize purse increases has the athletes pissed off, I just think it's a lack of funding and not from some organization not willing to share the funds. There were "rumors" that even Hamburg was going to pull out of hosting (turned out to be false), which I think is now $2mi on the host city in fees now. So I don't know that there is a ton of money being made in the WTCS series anymore.

2. With the news that the pto "contracts" are basically per race appearance fees, this will help and hurt some people. I think this will help the guys finishing in the "MOP" and quietly keep them in contention with the T10 guranteed contracts for '25 vs the handful of athletes who think/assume will race the min pto schedule to also allow for other races. So the PTO also incentivived the need to show up and race pto races with their "marketing" deals (I believe that was the term Sam called the contracts this year).

3. This is the biggest issue that PTO struggles with. Is it a matter of building your own race weekend vs "piggy backing" off an already established race venue + race setup.

4. I think a lot like WTCS now, it's always going to be venue specific. The WTCS bid requirements and the World Cup / Conti Cup level of host requirements aren't even in the same time zone. So thus boring urban race venues are the norm on WTCS while the "harder" courses are always the hard to travel to world cups it seems like. Miami speedway likely won't have any bike drama, neither will London course that apparently will likely be used. So I think there's not a ton of "hard" bike lets we are looking at anytime soon. But I think there's an ability to cause a little more "run fatigue" with the 20m gaps, so there is that; vs the straight up draft pack last 30km of bikes like at WTCS events.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

1.+ 2. On prize money I am extremely sceptical whether this is sustainable for the T100 series. I'm not really sure 100km races are actually gonna be any more or any less exciting as a WTCS race. So eventually this thing is gonna run out of steam or more likely come to a similar spot that WTCS finds itself in.

3. If you have time then build your own event. But if you don't, and they don't mark my words, then I think piggy backing and partnering is the only option.

One other thing to add. I'm not pointing any fingers, but I think if they are really trying to commercialise this, then a doping contingency plan needs to be in place. Cause there will be positives.

 then a doping contingency plan needs to be in place. Cause there will be positives.

------

I'm far too much of a cynic and realize our shit paying sport will never amount to anything real in the fight against doping. That even if tons of shanigans is going on, the chances of multiple positives is likely very rare.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

I wouldn't be so sure of that. Just a feeling....

But yeh even with potential positives, I too am cynical there'll be a fuck load getting away with it. Same goes for Athletics, Cycling, Swimming.

.
.
Yep,this is by far the best time ever to be a Pro triathlete. There will be "B" athletes this year making more money than they ever could five years ago and they will be riding the wave for as long as they can.I'd even go as far as to say that the T100 series has actually thrown a lifeline to the dying careers of several high profile people. Some will benefit from being included in the PTO series and some will benefit from the top tier athletes not doing the Ironman series.It is a win all around .

She also covered some routes in Ventura county that could hypothetically be used.
I seriously doubt that PTO will be allowed to put on a race in Malibu given the shenanigans with the Superleague/Epstein race thing.

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Next races on the schedule: none at the moment

Agree with Monty and TU wrt the several groups of athletes that stand to make good money. Clearly the contracted T100 athletes. Also, but significantly less (qv), those in the #20-#30 long distance capable in the IM Series. And because the top PTO ranked 30 will not race any other races (more or less) all the #31-#100 athletes have plenty of opportunity to earn prize money from all the non-IM Series races, as well as Roth/Challenge/Clash ones.

"great money from the new ironman series, literally as much as the PTO one" Well no. Take, as an example, the T100 athlete who finishes #10 in all their 6 races and finishes #10 in the final T100 standings (and no other race earnings). With a (say) $90k contract they will earn in total $155k. Compare that with an athlete who finishes #5 in their five IM Series races and #5 overall: $100k. NB an athlete who finishes #10 in their five IM Series races and #10 overall will earn 'not much'. https://t100triathlon.com/pro-series-explainer/ https://www.ironman.com/...es-race-series#bonus https://files.constantcontact.com/...4e0-db1ef125530f.pdf
"do folks expect athlete #1000 to be making 6 figures?" I looked at the 50+ best ranked US athlete: they seemed to have won zero prize money. Professional? (There are 107 listed)

Perhaps Thorsten could do a piece on the 51-100 'top' earners from 2023? Focus on the 'many' rather than the 'few'.
https://www.trirating.com/deep-dive-into-the-2023-triathlon-money-list/
(Athletes like Ryf, Chevalier and Long made circa $100k last year (prize money plus PTO EoY bonus).


"the dying careers of several high profile people" Who had you in mind @ThailandUltras? Bit disrespectful to T100's Gomez and Brownlee. McNamee per'aps? Or are you saying Haug's career is on the decline now she's 40+, or that Ryf would've given up without T100? Or are trying to say Sanders without saying 'Sanders'? In which latter case the 'all encompassing' thread is that way > > >

The top 20 will make plenty of money guaranteed by PTO. But they were already. The #20-40(50?) are the real winners, via the other opportunities around (which are better paid than before in terms of money, but not depth, and there are less of those races actually, thus they will concentrate those racers).
The #50+ was struggling before, and is not doing any better now. We can argue whether they should or not, but we're talking #80 making losses, which is very far from "#1000 making 6 figures". Growing the sports? (See UCI moving to minimum salaries...)

What I'm personally disappointed about is not the lack of money, but rather the circle closing around a top few, and the lack of opportunities to race the world bests. The gap between podium at amateur races easily and professional races is just widening, with no space in-between. I never made a living out of triathlon, reached #155 at my best right after 9th in Roth, but enjoyed lining up at Frankfurt between Jan and Patrick, riding 50k with Sebi in Roth, and many more chances to get challenged by the world champions... This looks unlikely this year.
(I understand many A-pros and fans think differently, but by talking with people ranked ~ #80-300 this sentiment is quite present as well)

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https://besse.info/
https://www.strava.com/athletes/2012033

I certainly agree with your assessment, in many aspects.

Statement #1: PTO budget for T100 participation money (appearance fee + accommodation being covered), race prize money and bonus prize money is >2-4x bigger than what IM offers to pros. Then there's also the PTO end-of-year bonus and the IM prize money outside of their series.

Statement #2: Sanders would've had his ass handed over to him every PTO race. His PTO race results have been: #7, #11, #21 (#20, if you strike through Collin Chartier). His #11 in PTO US Open remains his best scoring result of 2023. This just isn't his distance to shine. He might get and accept a wild card though, a proper win-win situation for both PTO (media attention) and LS ($).

What I'm personally disappointed about is not the lack of money, but rather the circle closing around a top few, and the lack of opportunities to race the world bests.

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The only events that is "closed" is now the current PTO series right? Hell now that the IM series is a real thing, this is actually the opportunity for long course athletes to race each other much more often. So I think what we've now done is actually create events where the world's best are racing more often. If that means the fringe guys get pinched out, so be it. But the overall health of professional ranking is much greater now than ever before. As far as I know the IM pro series is open to any professional, so now you actually have the chance to race "world class" fields in non-world championship races more often than just the world championship races.


(Of course this is all on thin ice it seems *if* PTO goes away, we all think IM Series as it is now will "go away" as well).

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

I have Vitoria and Frankfurt on my schedule. We'll see how it turns out

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https://besse.info/
https://www.strava.com/athletes/2012033

"great money from the new ironman series, literally as much as the PTO one" Well no.//


Not sure why you cherry picked certain places to make an argument against me, my statement was an overall $$ one. Think if you look at the winner of the ironman series, it will stack up pretty nice in the grand scheme of top earners this year.


And if what you say is true(will stipulate to your math and research, thanks), then that just means more folks will make some money vs just the top taking most in the PTO series. I see that complaint a lot, and in this thread even, so there is that.

Sorry @Monty your line is dead right. I was using your "literally as much as" comparison to share the difference between the earnings available. Last year, one or a few top twenty athletes swept in and scooped the podium winnings (Long, Sanders and fellow US travellers for example) on 70.3s. This year the top twenty will be all in on T100 and the next few on IM Series, and thus there'll be shedloads of races where the #40+ ranked athletes can travel, race, take wins, make podia, and make money.
Win; win; win.
Cherry picking: "look at the winner of the ironman series" If an athlete can win the IMWC, the 70.3WC and 3 more Series races and thus win the IM Series they might win $455k (we're talking Ryf at the top of her game (?2017)). Second in everything wins $277k; Third in everything wins $184k.

If a T100 athlete won her 6 races she would win $455.
So as you say "literally the same" for the winner (on those unlikely performance/results assumptions). However T100 2nd in all 6 and series: $336k, 3rd = $262k.
I suggest there's going to be some doubling up for the IM capable and aspirational athletes. Managing the load will be a serious challenge: I just hope their bodies can take it so that they're racing come the T100 Grand Final and Taupō.

one thing that PTO seems to be doing well (and something i've been really crying out for IM to do for a long time) is making good use of wildcards.

they're not too precious about the whole thing, and are saying that at every race there will be a small number of athletes added to the start list to build interest/excitement. to me, it's a great idea. you can recognize that these races are for entertainment and add interesting new athletes without turning it into a circus.

your move, IM.

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____________________________________
https://lshtm.academia.edu/MikeCallaghan

http://howtobeswiss.blogspot.ch/

For actual “world championships” I’m all for having everyone qualify the same way. Maybe some very rare exceptions but for the most part, for an actual 1 day world championships, spots imo don’t deserve to be given as “wild cards”. Pto imo is still very much more closer to SLT setup currently than an “real” championship like iMWC. So if they’re “regular season” events they want to invite whoever cool.

But when it’s an actual world championships I’m not really in favor of letting athletes in who didn’t really follow the same qualifying process, (I know validation allows some to AQ easier but they still have to race events instead of just showing up on start list + Olympic champion gets an auto start).

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

well world triathlon calls it
‘the official World Championship tour of long distance triathlon’. when they really mean middle distance triathlon.
iam prety sure super league does not have world champs title . the arena games i think might have some sort of title.

https://www.triathlon.org/...triathlon_world_tour

and dont forget even world triathlon has 2 invitational slots for each gender for the oly games

What I mean is that the T100 is essentially "regular" events and only the GF or the world championship actually would qualify as anything "meaningful" beyond a regular season type of event. I mentioned the exceptions, but this idea that you should fill wild cards to get the best viewing for a world championship type of 1 day event I don't think is the best approach. If you have a qualification process, I'm not really in favor of pulling favors for athletes who "didn't qualify", unless it's extradordinary circumstances (winning an IM with 100m to and fan attacks you, etc when it was clear you would have won it; and yes the Olympic Champion normally qualifies as this type of circumstance because for the most part it's too specialized these days to try and do both really really well; Norwegians withstanding).

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Agree Mike, wildcards to fill the startlist back up to 20 offers a chance to athletes storming onto the scene, or if good enough, local interest - to help multiply story lines. Every one of the 'regular' seven T100s will afford that opportunity (I shared the math upthread but it'll be about 4 per race (average)).
"Start number limited to 20, so 140 starts plus GF. Contracted athletes at minimum will fill 94: assumes Knibb, Duffy and Spivey race Olympics. This means there'll be maximum 46 'wildcard' slots (likely less as several will do 6 of 7 and a few 7 of 7) so say 28 slots. Divided between 7 races that's average 4 wild cards per race."
Agree with @pk: let's call a spade a spade (not a shovel): this is middle distance and does not need to masquerade as 'long distance'. There's room for both and TRI (ex-ITU) have their Long Distance champs (this year in Townsville) decided in a 'one day' race (participation regulated/selected by national governing bodies).
There will be no 'wildcards' awarded to compete in the T100 Grand Final. All the contracted athletes (20 + 20) will be given a start slot. In addition any athlete who, as a result of their performance in one or more regular T100 races where they have been given a wildcard, has scored more T100 points than the lowest contracted athlete will get a start slot. That's the message.
However I suspect that because some of those 20 are bound to be injured or have multiple mechanicals (no names, no pack drill) and thus score rather few points, this may be finessed slightly to specify that the parvenu will need to be above the lowest contracted athlete who has completed 3 regular events (rather than the plain last).
Think we can expect Blummenfelt and Iden, maybe Le Corre, to qualify on that basis, though maybe Iden and Le Corre will be concentrating on Taupō. Can't think of any women though. Maybe one of: Stimpson, Sala, Langridge, Salthouse, Derron, Learmonth, Zaferes, Løvseth, Klamer.

I understand why it’s a downer for you potentially (less opportunity to toe the line with the stars of our sport), but even you may recognise that this is how a more major sport should function (the best racing the best more often)!

Is your brother still racing too?

Maybe I missed it, but is Malibu the suspected California round or is there another venue that’s more likely?

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Peak NA Cocktails for Recovery
Youtube

Sam confirmed today the CA date is not Malibu.

It'll take a while to get used to seeing "T100" races actually on the WT website and have actual event race pages like the WTCS circuit pages have. The Miami one will be a very easy telecast assuming it'll all be on the speedway. Should make for very easy broadcasting, the "tactics" may likely suffer, but from an feasibility standpoint- likely couldn't ask for a better opener.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

I understand why it goes this way, I'm just not excited for it as many other. I'll be fine.

Nah he stopped after having to operate a haglund's deformity. He's a happy dad now. Still into endurance sports but more globally than triathlon (ski touring, ultracycling,...)

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https://besse.info/
https://www.strava.com/athletes/2012033

In the ProTriNews podcast (31 January), Renouf was asked, towards the end, about the $300k letter to Epstein and whether Malibu was on the cards. He said, not this year not next year but never say never and shared the reason behind the PTO's support for keeping a race going in Malibu.
https://protrinews.buzzsprout.com/1736374/14395410-epsiode-149-pto-tour-2024-with-sam-renouf
The June T100 race is "southern California". People have speculated that, given the date, the race may be San Francisco way. Twenty wetsuited athletes could get off Hornblower fairly fairly and with only 20 competitors the bike course could be televised safely with minimal moto drafting. They could fit Raceranger to the motos, with the distance set at 40m (say).
https://twitter.com/realBertBlocken/status/1545119860543340544/photo/1
Moto 40m ahead gets you a 10% power saving (@?50kph
But Renouf has said "southern" and SF that isn't.
Sea World was a great visit, a while ago now. I had no idea (at the time) that that was Mission Bay. 50th anniversary!

On the Triathlon Hour with Jack yesterday - Renouf said it will NOT be in Malibu for sure, so there goes that theory.

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DFRU - Detta Family Racing Unit...the kids like it and we all get out and after it...gotta keep the fam involved!

Still trying to figure that venue out. It wont also be the Long Beach venue that will likely become the LA Games Olympic course because that race is middle July.

Would they do something on the San Diego Island where tri was "born" (is it called Fiesta Island that has like a decent bike loop that they could do)?

I think that would mean it would be an basically a "PTO produced" event?!?

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Yeah I had that same thought about Fiesta Island too. It might make sense? They host the Tritonman and Mission Bay Triathlons around there - and the island would be easy to control traffic. But not sure. Escape date matches but I can't see a good course for TT bikes in downtown SF. Like they couldn't use the Escape bike course for a lapped course I wouldn't think.

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DFRU - Detta Family Racing Unit...the kids like it and we all get out and after it...gotta keep the fam involved!

Still trying to figure that venue out. It wont also be the Long Beach venue that will likely become the LA Games Olympic course because that race is middle July. //

I think more than that, the fact that Super League has already made a partnership with that race. So many strange bedfellows now in race production going on, gonna be hard to figure out who will partner with who going forward. I'm sure SL is not real happy with the PTO funding the Malibu take over against their presumed ownership, so probably a tit for tat on that Long Beach race anyway.


Fiesta Island would be a much easier course than San Francisco, but easy is not always the driving factor. We have seen that these orgs will throw a lot of $$ at difficult courses, so both areas are in play, until they are not. Fiesta Island would be cool, it is basically the birthplace of modern triathlon. I think it was the 2nd race I ever did back in the late 70's, and it was a run/bike/swim format for maximum cramping potential!!!

i've said before: - i think a possibility for PTO back in the day, instead of creating their own race series and taking on all the hassle that involves, would be to partner with some classics. rather than trying to reinvent the wheel there in california, go to escape from alcatraz. say to them, "hey, you guys know how to put on a great race with lots of heritage and perfect broadcast potential. wanna be the US open?" pump in extra money for prize money, signage, broadcasts, and go for it.

then look around the world and do the same with noosa? phuket? st croix? roth? zofingen? rather than getting tied to the 100k format, this would also open up possibilities for other formats and leverage some already-successful, media-friendly properties. imagine the images of kanute and jan smashing through the waves, or of ash and annie running along under the golden gate bridge. epic stuff!

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https://lshtm.academia.edu/MikeCallaghan

http://howtobeswiss.blogspot.ch/

A Maurten Move:
https://www.linkedin.com/...edium=member_desktop
https://protriathletes.org/...riathlon-world-tour/
Is there no getting away from the pesky stuff.

L O L that's just great.....although I guess we'll get it in an Aussie accent (JK) vs the Americans on the IM telecasts.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Looks like the PTO USA race will be Escape from Alcatraz in San Francisco on June 8. Just ran into some road closure information posted by the PTO in my neighborhood in the Inner Richmond in SF

Great scoop!

Would it still be the 100k distance?

So not “Southern California” haha. Las Vegas is closer to Southern California then San Francisco.

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Peak NA Cocktails for Recovery
Youtube

Posted by the Professional Athletes Organization Triathlon . . . mmmm who dey OYL
https://www.escapealcatraztri.com/ (on June 9)

This would be the worst bike ever to watch! Thank goodness this guy signed up today to tell us!!!

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DFRU - Detta Family Racing Unit...the kids like it and we all get out and after it...gotta keep the fam involved!

Tbf, @dfru, that's very likely the Alcatraz road closure requirement (in that neighborhood). The lines don't purport to be the bike course.
There's only so much you can do with photoshop (or similar). And if the T100 is there Saturday June 8, they would need the road closed beyond 11am, I think (M and W races: 6am and 9am starts: women still on bike course at 11am). Sunrise is at 5:47. For Alcatraz the following day, 11am will be sufficient.
https://www.instagram.com/p/C3BJNAqPff9/
See comments: "Photo cred @tomdebruyn1985"
Blanco: "That’s a potential road closure map in the Seacliff neighborhood which is part of the traditional Alcatraz bike course"
After all that, I am not saying (double negative alert) that having the T100 race there, the day before Alcatraz wouldn't be viable. The bike loop is 18 miles but 5 laps turning at the Palace of the Legion of Honor would fit nicely, and keep things compact (for both tele-visual and road side spectators) with the run below (with sand and steps: I really hope so). And would also meet several of PTO's requirements: iconic venue, 'big city', race for amateurs, spectators on the course, proven RD and org. Starts might reasonably be 8am and 11am for broadcast and spectator friendliness.
How about a Hornblower ramp start but closer (for tv coverage, and NB mist/fog) and an aussie exit (again coverage) for another 3/4 mile loop before back to Marina Green?

Might we assume Renouf's oft repeated "southern" was an effort to minimise focus on this Californian possibility. PTO will be announcing the venue shortly: in the ProTriNews interview he said (iirc) that there was one more (?city authority) permission to get. Next week, to maintain the PTO/T100 SM dominance/stream of consciousness.

OK, I jumped the gun on my negativity - I hate that haha. It definitely doesn't mean that's the exact bike course, for sure. Or...Even the bike course? When I try to map it out on strava, that is only like a mile and a half assuming they aren't going to do the out and backs on each road. Is there somewhere that they could have the swim at say - China Beach? And then you have the outer part the bike course into the Presidio (I think) that they could loop?

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DFRU - Detta Family Racing Unit...the kids like it and we all get out and after it...gotta keep the fam involved!

As I suggested up thread, I see no reason, for the swim, that they couldn't replicate the Hornblower ferry start. Normally start in 8s so 20 Pros can go for it "fairly fairly". Have them line up in reverse swim speed order.
GTN:

All in on using the PTO series to get ready for a sub 7:30 Kona winning time.

smart play for ben, i think.

he's already got his kona slot, so doesn't need to do any more full IMs this year. and he's able to be competitive across distances, so he could bring home some money at PTO events. it also avoids the risk of carrying fatigue from full-distance racing into kona, which we've seen before from guys who go bonkers at events like roth and are still flat months later. i've always liked kanute's approach - he seems thoughtful about this stuff.

i also have to say that for an athlete like him (or ali brownlee, or whoever), i think i'd say go all-in on the PTO for now. IM will always be there, but PTO might not be. cash in while you can and then if the PTO series folds, fine - go back to doing what you were before.

i'm curious to see how it'll play for 2025, though - anyone who wants to do kona/nice/70.3 worlds will need to qualify and validate, somewhere, which means fitting in a lot of racing around the PTO schedule. starts to really add up!

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https://lshtm.academia.edu/MikeCallaghan

http://howtobeswiss.blogspot.ch/

Tim Heming interview: recommended:

YES! My boy Travis and Tim! It's a good episode. Lots of good stuff.

I help Travis out with the race podcast just in case anyone wants to find out what kind of crap can come out of my mouth!

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DFRU - Detta Family Racing Unit...the kids like it and we all get out and after it...gotta keep the fam involved!

I was very surprised to hear Rico Bogan say he didn’t get offered a PTO contract until a week before the tour announcement. I’m gonna guess they were waiting on Hayden Wilde who decided to pass at the last minute, but I have absolutely no inside knowledge on this.

As a matter of fact, Rico himself says the proposal came 4 days before the announcement (source: interview on Talking Triathlon).

My take:

1. A lot of people assumed that the 70.3 title was a one-off in a field that was softer than usual, and well, nothing has disproven this idea so far. Maybe the PTO was waiting for Rico to race and win somewhere. His only finish since Lahti has been 3rd place at Challenge Vieux Bocau. He did beat Brownlee and Funk.

2. Rico has his work cut out in terms of media presence and skills. This quite possibly matters to the PTO? Young PROs have it hard enough without a ton of hilarious stories to tell from their "career" of 6 years, including 4 as a short course junior/U23, but it's also a matter of being able to speak in a way that is lively, relatively fast-paced and addresses the most interesting aspects of the question (this is where Rico's current level of English might be a limiter as he's not that fluent).

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"FTP is a bit 2015, don't you think?" - Gustav Iden

Some decent insights from Baekkegaard, in particular the challenge of pacing and peaking through the year.
And sounds as if he's trapped.

The T-100 view from someone we don't hear a lot of around here.

Fred Funke said today he got $70,000 for his contract. I wonder if top 5 got $100k, 5-10 got $90k, 10-15 got $80k and 15-20 got $70k. Every athlete going home with minimum $100k for the season seems like a pretty darn good deal for a lot of these guys and gals.

Funk was #14 in the mid December PTO Rankings so in the #11-16 tranche.
For how much is earned (well for 2023, winnings and PTO bonus) Thorsten did the analysis:
https://www.trirating.com/...riathlon-money-list/
In the long course athletes, 8 WPRO and 12 MPRO earned >$100k.
With the additional PTO/T100 monies and the extra $2M from Ironman, those figures will be significantly higher. As said, Funk, if he fulfills his contract is guaranteed $70k, plus 6 x £2.5k (finishing #11 or lower in his minimum 6 races = $15k) plus a tour series bonus of >$15k: a total of >$100k.
https://t100triathlon.com/pro-series-explainer/
An athlete (eg Funk) finishing an average of #10 in 6 T100s, and #10 overall will earn $135k, to which might be added another $30k for the end-of-year PTO Bonus.
Compare that with IM Series winnings and series bonus: an average of #8 (2x70.3, 3x IM) gets you circa $65k.
And some of the T100 athletes will dabble in IM (eg an IMWCQ and Nice, and Taupo) which will push their totals up, if they can stay uninjured on that number of races.
As an aside, on that trirating money deep dive, I note that the order of WPRO (long course) athletes is very close to the 2023 PTO ranking list (NB Ryf's figure does not include her Roth participation fee).

That’s a very generous package and I hope T100 can keep this going for years to come! It will be good for the sport!

I thought the cut off was end Aug? Or were there 2 cut offs?

Any idea if the contract comes with health insurance and is insured for injury?

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

I'm guessing not, else they'd be talking about it. A much better bang for the buck would be if the PTO paid for disability insurance for their top 20 though. They don't need to be on the hook for covering therapy and hospitalization bills, etc. But it would be a pretty good move to buy a policy with Aflac or some disability insurance company, and then sell them some marketing benefits in the process.

Athletes who get insured could be insured to get paid 8k a month in disability benefits. That policy doesn't seem like it would be too expensive and they'd likely make more back than they paid in advertising sales to the company (assuming it became a sponsor, which is an ideal fit to have a big money insurer as an advertiser).,