Aren't those rules only for professionals? I didn't think they were checking shoes of amateur athletes.

No idea what the actual rules are, but I’d be totally fine if enforcement only happened at the finish line. If you’re trying to KQ you should know these aren’t allowed (if that’s the case) and shouldn’t be able to claim a spot, but why on earth would anyone care if the person finishing 35th in their AG ran in these?

These are super comfy. I tried on a pair about 6 weeks ago. We've had them in the store for sale for the last month.

Everyone who puts them on loves them. 100%.

Not everyone loves the price. I just wish they came in wide

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

Applies to both Pro and AG. It’s a DQ.

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Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One

Lack of wide is a bit concerning. I will see how they fit. I’m normally okay in a size 12 regular (but far prefer wide) with Hoka and reviews say they’re roomy.

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Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One

So this is a Hokas answer to Asics Superblast and Adidas Prime X? Yeah I don’t get why they ban these for AG. If they are not going for the money, podium or KQ, it shouldn’t matter. I can see the point though. They want to draw a line somewhere

Does it replace the Bondi X? I noticed the Bondi X (my shoe) apparently is now gone from the Hoka website.

I imagine race officials will enforce stack height rules similar to drafting, i.e. focusing mostly on the pros and FOP age-groupers. I doubt they'll be DQ'ing people right and left at the finish line and withholding finisher medals. It would be, for instance, a PR disaster if IM DQ'ed a cancer survivor or wounded warrior at the Ironman finish line because their shoe is too tall.

Listen to the slowtwitch podcast with Jimmy Riccitello - it may not be a race official in the course of the event, it could be a racing peer or a spectator that reports you and prompts an investigation where things like race day photos may be reviewed.

Is this a training shoe primarily? If so, why does it have a carbon plate? Didn’t we just have a long discussion about training in non carbon shoes?

I’m just confused what the intent of the shoe is and who’s the audience.

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blog

No. It's got a different feel than the Bondi X

This is an ultra plush shoe. In fact I'd call it the most plush running shoe on the market.

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

I would love to hear how they go for you, I was really disappointed in my last pair of Bondi's. And like many here, I like a wider shoe, but often just go with a bigger one to accommodate, so would like your take on their sizing too..

And to the guy that asked who would these be for, well just about everyone of us that got hooked on the original Bondi and now find the new versions just too stiff. At least that would be my hope..

Yes, it's a training shoe. I also see this shoe replacing the people who use the Bondi because they are on their feet all day. Medical field, warehouse workers, people standing all day for work. (these groups were ~ 75% of our Bondi sales over the last 24mo, not runners). Now if some of them can get over the price tag is another story.

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

So the Bondi X, Hoka's previous plush-and-plated shoe went away at the same time a new plush/plated shoe arrived purely by coincidence?

Edit: Not trying to be snarky...I realize you could have interpreted my question as "Is the new shoe like the Bondi X?"

My question was more, "Does Hoka intend this as their new plush/plated shoe that will replace the Bondi X? Or is the Bondi X just gone because it's being updated?"

As a Bondi X user I have two answers.

First, a racing shoe is whatever shoe you race in. And the Skyward X or Bondi X are just fine to race in. Yes, you'll give a second or two per km in weight. If that matters to you.

Second, I find myself running a little different in plated shoes. The Bondi X "rewards" subtle differences in stride. I like it. I think it makes sense to train how you race. Back in my collegiate running days I'd wear the minimalist stuff the best marathoners were running...now at age 50....yeah, the Skyward X ain't gonna hold me back.

That said, I think it makes almost no sense for non-runners - medical people, etc - to wear a plated shoe. Unless there's literally no other way to get the magical plushness.

Thanks. I ran in a bondi x a few years ago. After 1-2 runs I wasn’t a fan. Ended up sending them back.

How would these compare to the ASICS nimbus? I started running in them recently (nimbus 25) to help with coming back from a major injury and over a year and half of not running. I’m a fan so far but I’m not running anything fast and just trying to put in consistent slow running without anything flaring up. I can see myself running in these long term for easy runs.

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blog

They're no peer if they report the 52nd in the age group for wearing this or the prime x, they're just an a-hole. Screams Marathon investigation type shenanigans, remember, dumb shit that has caused people to commit suicide.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

The Hoka rep didn't frame it as this is a Bondi X replacement. More along the lines this is a very plush shoe built on the J or H frame (I can't remember which) that is designed for people who want the max cushioning available in any shoe in any brand. When I put it on I took 2 steps forward, turned and asked if it came in wide. If it had I would have ordered it on the spot. Especially given dealer cost.

It's the most plush shoe and the most comfortable shoe I've ever put on my feet. Full stop. Or at least that i can remember.

Sorry I can't more directly answer your is the Bondi X going away. I feel like I heard that it was but don't quote me on that.

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

What medical people, warehouse workers, people on their feet all day long want is comfort so their feet are not hurting at the end of a 6h surgery or a 12h shift walking 17 miles on concrete. They don't care if it's plated or not. They want cush, they want softness, they want to feel like their feet are being hugged on a pillow and not on a hard piece of foam.

They often self select a plated shoe based on these factors. You can bring them the Brooks ghost to try and the Brooks Glycerin 11/10 they select the Glycerin or Nimbus over the ghost. I suspect they will now select the Skyward

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

I like the Nimbus 26 better than the 25. In fact a lot of our Hoka Bondi users have switched to the Nimbus. Call it ~ 20%

The Skyward is going to be more plush......I think.

Haven't tried them on side by side. I'll do that next week. Currently in ATL doing some aero testing.

If I don't follow up on this shoot me a message to try them on side by side and report back for you and everyone else.

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

I agree completely - should have had "peer" in quotes - the point was that the the podcast spoke to this technical item specifically and a shoe protest could very well come from someone other than an official and that such protests, with sufficient phot or video evidence, would be considered and could result in a DQ. Now why that can't be done with Race Ranger and drafting, who knows - maybe why Race Ranger was turned down in the last minute at Oceanside. Developing technology is code switch for "imagine the barrage of protests we'll get for the video frame with the blinky red light".

My wife, a nurse, wears Hokas. No need to "splain" to me what people who work on their feet like. I'm just making the point that the plate probably has nothing to do with the decision process, and I already made the point that if a plated shoe is the only one that works for other reasons, then fine.

We've had good luck with people choosing the Brooks Ghost Max over the Bondi, plus the price point is far more reasonable, and comes wide.

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Kiwami Racing Team

Hoka had these to demo at last night's pub run (here as main shoe sponsor for the Big Sur International Marathon).

The Skyward X had rave reviews from all the runners demoing them. I really like them myself, very plush and light, didn't feel the height compromised stability. I can't really compare them to other new cushioned trainers as I mostly run trails in some older shoes. I would definitely start running again on harder surfaces with these.

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Chris
*********************
“Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming "Wow! What a Ride!”
― Hunter S. Thompson,

So now we're picking and choosing which rules apply to which competitors?

Either the rules(as written) apply to everyone or they don't.

If that causes a problem with the 52nd overall competitor in an age group getting DQ'd I would argue that's probably a strong indication that the rule as its currently written is a bad rule.

If this shoe is more plush than the Prime X Strung, I’m interested. The PXS is the most plush shoe I’ve ran in, in over 40 years of running, and what’s more, I’m at 800 miles on my first pair, and they aren’t showing any signs of flattening or leaning. That was always my biggest gripe with Hoka Bondis…after about 300 miles, they would crush towards the outside of the midsole, and I felt like a bowlegged cowboy. The PXS isn’t doing that at all.

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Athlinks / Strava

IDK if it's more plush than the Prime X strung as I've not put that on. I will say that your observation of the Bondi being worn out after 300 miles is a common refrain we've been hearing from customers for the last year. It's losing them retail sales.


On a side note, I'm in the ATL airport right now and am seeing a lot of Hokas and a few alphaflys on people's feet.

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

We've been selling them in our store for a couple weeks and I see this as a great training shoe for someone that likes the Bondi. Similar fit (runs Hoka narrowish - no wide width option), cushion, neutral support but an improved lightweight upper for a runner. The front midsole under the toes isn't as thick as the Bondi which would also benefit the runner over jogger or walker.

I'm my opinion it's fast forefoot rocker doesn't allow for any noticeable spring propulsion from the carbon place.

A heavier runner, those with stiff & wide feet that tend to underpronate, want to run off the pavement may want to make sure the lateral midsole isn't too soft. For a foot that pronates normally or overpronates a bit the medial midsole has some firmness. Hoka did a good job finding a balance with such a thick midsole. We find the Bondi breaks down laterally too quickly for a lot of people.

To add to the topic of a well cushioned race day shoe the Asics Edge/Sky Paris are outstanding. I think it's the bounciest but most supportive super shoe in it's class and it's not forever sold out. I would recommend though for a quick runner.

Generally a case of it depends. But Golf went away from allowing people to call in rule violations people saw on TV.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

I got 350 running miles out the Bondi 6. Haven't had a fresh pair since, got a 7 at the road runner used sale but I suspect they were used by someone who was significantly heavier than I because they were dead in the 50 miles I put on them. 350 miles for me at the time of being 205-215 pound runner is a lot of miles. These people who talk of 5-600 miles on shoes clearly are lying or weight 120lbs.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

So to use a golf analogy, player is going to finish 36 holes in a tie for 75th, they're missing the cut and on the 18th hole they hit a drive OB. They don't bother to hit a provisional, and instead of taking stroke and distance they walk up the fairway and play their next shot from where the ball went out of bounds. They finish the round, sign their scorecard and since they don't make the cut they weren't getting paid or impacting anyone else's results.

Would everyone in golf say "it depends" and we'd apply the rule differently if you were leading the tournament?

I seriously doubt that even if it was an amateur tournament.

we can talk about this in regards to other similar rules. So 52nd place AG should also be allowed to stuff their chest with fairings?

Chucking a pair of shoes on is not the same thing as stuffing a bottle in your chest for aero. Everyone and their mother does the former. Only people who take this sport very seriously do the latter.

It's not your weight but the fact that Hoka use EVA, which has crap longevity. I'm 190lbs and get about 350mi out of most EVA shoes like you do. But every TPE shoe I've had lasted easily 500 miles and I only replaced them to try something new. The Prime X mentioned above uses TPE and will easily last 500mi at your weight.

PEBA for racing
TPE for training
EVA for the history books

Eh, 350 is like the max on any shoe I've gotten regardless of brand. But previously it was the rubber wearing out when shoes had a lot of rubber. Hoka is just barely going to a decent amount of coverage, but most shoes rubber is very thin now.

Runner right now is Gel Nimbus 25 and it's a big time meh for me, should have gone NB More v4. No idea what FF+ Ecoblast is made from.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

The Prime X Strung has a Continental tire rubber outsole… I can’t make a dent in it.

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Athlinks / Strava

The Conti rubber that Adidas used to use would outlast the midsole. IDK if it's the same or a formulation close to it. It was The Best outsole in the industry. Now with everyone taking away rubber from the non impact areas we're seeing degradation from the outside in due to rocks, rough roads/trails etc.

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

I tried them on and liked them but much prefer my Rockets x2.

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Next races on the schedule: none at the moment

You aren’t lying. They are unbelievably cushy and bouncy.

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Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One

I “think” the regular size of the Skyward X is a bit roomier than a regular Bondi. Not as roomy as a wide Bondi but they felt fine. I’d still prefer a wide version.

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Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One

Do they run true to size or do most people have to half size up or down?

True to size for me.

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

Agree

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Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One