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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [RowToTri] [ In reply to ]
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It's a huge margin and he wasn't pushed. How much faster could he go?//

On the bike and run, not much if any. He was pushed by the clock, and watching the race, he drilled it from the gun to the finish. Being able to pace your own run will most often get you your best time, vs having to chase or run with others who may be faster or surgey.


There are a half dozen guys in ITU that are now doing 70.3's who will be tough to beat, along with some of the PTO series guys that are either in front of him, or just behind. You dont have these gaps in PTO races, and like I said, who are the next 3 guys here? Look like up and coming pros who had a great day for them.


My big question now is does sam start thinking about the Ironman series?? I mean no one in this race is really going to be a factor, almost 500 points lost just to 2nd. I mean he probably cannot win the thing, but with one, maybe two fulls, well it could be possible to podium?? He could still get some good $$ for doing 5 half's at this level too, especially with a great worlds performance at the end. Has to be entering his mind I bet, so perhaps a full will suddenly appear on the horizon after a little break now for a good training bloc...
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [pier87] [ In reply to ]
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pier87 wrote:
Ajax Bay wrote:
Tri247's take:
https://www.tri247.com/...-pro-series-sam-long
IM: https://proseries.ironman.com/...ronman-703-st-george
31 WPros; 70 MPros on the start list.
Following now not on start list:
Moench (F3)
Thek (F4)

Additions: Currie added (M6) - after his DNF/did not run on Saturday
Last year: https://www.trirating.com/...3-analyzing-results/
Metzler(W) is wearing F1: https://stats.protriathletes.org/athlete/jeanni-metzler
Findlay (F2), though, is the standout favourite.


piece of cake for Sam and Paula.

as planned.
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [pier87] [ In reply to ]
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Who’s that Connor Weaver guy? He just ran a 1:08:34!!! Is that a run course record?
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [TulkasTri] [ In reply to ]
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https://www.orlando2024trials.com/...142/34/connor-weaver

Google found this. I wonder if he's done a full yet? Says he's a Pro Tri in that link.

http://www.sfuelsgolonger.com
Last edited by: timr: May 4, 24 10:27
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [] [ In reply to ]
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Taupo slots to:
Costes, Wilkowiecki, Sandi, Andrie(#12)
Metzler, Frades, Simpson, McBride
Disappointing to see no coverage of Hamilton running up into second. He passed Quenet and Sperl at about 13km and never looked back.
Did we even see him finish? With commentators focusing on Quenet, Laundry and Costes (in the mix for #3, 100 seconds back).
Hering tried and tried, closing to 22 seconds at 14km but Salthouse looked as if she'd held a bit back for that last 7km. And Findlay eased off massively/sensibly in the last 5km.
Hering shared she will be racing IM Hamburg: it'd be her first IM for 9 years! IM Pro Series influence.
Findlay thinks she might enjoy IMMT, next year - "we'll see!"


Think Long jumps to #1 on the PTO Rankings (with this score = about 98 with the 5% bonus) and as Blummenfelt drops off the plot (has to count his #35 finish in Lahti).
And Findlay (with 92.6) climbs a place, above Philipp.
Last edited by: Ajax Bay: May 4, 24 13:50
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [TulkasTri] [ In reply to ]
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TulkasTri wrote:
Who’s that Connor Weaver guy? He just ran a 1:08:34!!! Is that a run course record?

Pure runner. 2:13 marathon, sub 14 5k guy
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [TulkasTri] [ In reply to ]
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Slightly new run course this year, which was new in 2022. Weaver ran D1 but has a # of youth results from 2011-2014. Looks like he's making the jump from road running back to triathlon. He had the fastest run at Oceanside but only biked 2:30. He biked 2:18 today, which shows some good improvement. 1:08 is ridiculous with 700+ feet of vert. If he can get better on the bike, he'll be dangerous within the next couple of years. He swam with Sam Long today.
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [timr] [ In reply to ]
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timr wrote:
https://www.orlando2024trials.com/...142/34/connor-weaver

Google found this. I wonder if he's done a full yet? Says he's a Pro Tri in that link.

Perezsandi is Tomas’s training partner. 3rd fastest run of the day, but he also needs to improve that swim/bike.
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [dcpinsonn] [ In reply to ]
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [dcpinsonn] [ In reply to ]
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Very well done - especially the astute quick takes. These articles offer more insight than the usual “they raced, they won, they came second, hot day, tough course, slots, etc.” but are a quick and easy read.

Style wise, something to consider in general: you only ever refer to athletes by their names (never: “the Canadian”, “the reigning 70.3 world champion”, etc.), which gets repetitive and - for lack of a better word - dry. It’s probably something you do on purpose to achieve clarity, but if there were a vote, I’d vote for referring to athletes in more varied ways when they are mentioned in the text multiple times.

"FTP is a bit 2015, don't you think?" - Gustav Iden
Last edited by: kajet: May 4, 24 15:01
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [Ajax Bay] [ In reply to ]
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Ajax Bay wrote:
Taupo slots to:
Costes, Wilkowiecki, Sandi, Andrie(#12)
Metzler, Frades, Simpson, McBride
Disappointing to see no coverage of Hamilton running up into second. He passed Quenet and Sperl at about 13km and never looked back.
Did we even see him finish? With commentators focusing on Quenet, Laundry and Costes (in the mix for #3, 100 seconds back).
Hering tried and tried, closing to 22 seconds at 14km but Salthouse looked as if she'd held a bit back for that last 7km. And Findlay eased off massively/sensibly in the last 5km.
Hering shared she will be racing IM Hamburg: it'd be her first IM for 9 years! IM Pro Series influence.
Findlay thinks she might enjoy IMMT, next year - "we'll see!"


Think Long jumps to #1 on the PTO Rankings (with this score = about 98 with the 5% bonus) and as Blummenfelt drops off the plot (has to count his #35 finish in Lahti).
And Findlay (with 92.6) climbs a place, above Philipp.

Paula has always said no way to a full, but I was thinking Ottawa being new next year might get her to change her mind. I think Nice would be a great course for her. Kona not so much as she hates the heat.

Let food be thy medicine...
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [dcpinsonn] [ In reply to ]
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Great write up. In regards to your quick take 3 on the run, the run as definitely more difficult than 2022/23 years except for when we climbed up red cliffs in 2020/21.

This year we traded the flat section in town with a loop around the park for more climbing back out of town with a loop around the church. Significantly more climbing than last year, but Sam has said he loves the descents so it suited him well too.

StG is such a great race. I'm always surprised it doesn't sell out.
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [dcpinsonn] [ In reply to ]
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I don't mind if you always call the racers by their name but rather I just wish you would put names under the photos where you can not see the racer's name. In this article, I don't know who the chick in the flowered tri suit is and I don't know who the guy on the bike is. He looks kind of like the guy getting his bike out in transition but OTOH the color of his leggings is black in the bike rack picture vs white in the pic where he's standing up on the bike, so who knows. I've noticed this in several past articles also. I follow tri fairly closely but I don't what all the pros look like. :)


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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ericmulk wrote:


I don't mind if you always call the racers by their name but rather I just wish you would put names under the photos where you can not see the racer's name. In this article, I don't know who the chick in the flowered tri suit is and I don't know who the guy on the bike is. He looks kind of like the guy getting his bike out in transition but OTOH the color of his leggings is black in the bike rack picture vs white in the pic where he's standing up on the bike, so who knows. I've noticed this in several past articles also. I follow tri fairly closely but I don't what all the pros look like. :)

Are you being thick or do you really have no idea who Ellie Salthouse is?

Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [TheStroBro] [ In reply to ]
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TheStroBro wrote:
ericmulk wrote:


I don't mind if you always call the racers by their name but rather I just wish you would put names under the photos where you can not see the racer's name. In this article, I don't know who the chick in the flowered tri suit is and I don't know who the guy on the bike is. He looks kind of like the guy getting his bike out in transition but OTOH the color of his leggings is black in the bike rack picture vs white in the pic where he's standing up on the bike, so who knows. I've noticed this in several past articles also. I follow tri fairly closely but I don't what all the pros look like. :)


Are you being thick or do you really have no idea who Ellie Salthouse is?

Well, I thought it was her but wasn't sure. What about the the guy on the bike??? I have abso no idea who he is.


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [TheStroBro] [ In reply to ]
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As a more than casual fan, I did not know it was Salthouse. Captions are good.

Aaron Bales
Lansing Triathlon Team
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [monty] [ In reply to ]
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monty wrote:
It's a huge margin and he wasn't pushed. How much faster could he go?//

On the bike and run, not much if any. He was pushed by the clock, and watching the race, he drilled it from the gun to the finish. Being able to pace your own run will most often get you your best time, vs having to chase or run with others who may be faster or surgey.


There are a half dozen guys in ITU that are now doing 70.3's who will be tough to beat, along with some of the PTO series guys that are either in front of him, or just behind. You dont have these gaps in PTO races, and like I said, who are the next 3 guys here? Look like up and coming pros who had a great day for them.


My big question now is does sam start thinking about the Ironman series?? I mean no one in this race is really going to be a factor, almost 500 points lost just to 2nd. I mean he probably cannot win the thing, but with one, maybe two fulls, well it could be possible to podium?? He could still get some good $$ for doing 5 half's at this level too, especially with a great worlds performance at the end. Has to be entering his mind I bet, so perhaps a full will suddenly appear on the horizon after a little break now for a good training bloc...

I chatted with Sam at Eric Wynn's ST get together BBQ in St. George. It "sounds" like Sam may be contemplating a full IM this summer some time. He mentioned Penticton being an option
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [Lurker4] [ In reply to ]
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Lurker4 wrote:


Great write up. In regards to your quick take 3 on the run, the run as definitely more difficult than 2022/23 years except for when we climbed up red cliffs in 2020/21.

This year we traded the flat section in town with a loop around the park for more climbing back out of town with a loop around the church. Significantly more climbing than last year, but Sam has said he loves the descents so it suited him well too.

StG is such a great race. I'm always surprised it doesn't sell out.

Just out of curiosity how much vertical did you have on the 2024 run in st. George vs 2023/2022?
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
monty wrote:
My big question now is does sam start thinking about the Ironman series?? . . . I mean he probably cannot win the thing, but with one, maybe two fulls, well it could be possible to podium?? He could still get some good $$ for doing 5 half's at this level too, especially with a great worlds performance at the end. Has to be entering his mind I bet, so perhaps a full will suddenly appear on the horizon after a little break now for a good training bloc...
I chatted with Sam at Eric Wynn's ST get together BBQ in St. George. It "sounds" like Sam may be contemplating a full IM this summer some time. He mentioned Penticton being an option
Penticton isn't a Series race, however lovely and a living/surviving legend (and I appreciate the reason you might float that).
I'd be surprised if he chose to race an IM just 'for fun': to be meaningful surely he would want to race a stacked field? And racing anywhere except an IM Pro Series race will be a 'B' field (racing one would take prize money from the the neo-pros who need it).
Long's two top 70.3s plus 2700+ points at Taupo means he could rack up 12000 points with two more 70.3s.
With his contracted T100 events, whilst he needs to race 3 more times, plus GF, he only needs one more podium in the regular season races. That determines when he might slot in an IM (or heaven help us two IMs) or two more 70.3s, or one of each.
So which T100 offers his best chance of good points? Probably not SF with its swim and climbing, and van Riel there btw.
London looks good with Ibiza a possible, but with an enhanced level of post Olympic competition. Las Vegas will lose all the Kona bound athletes but that'll mean a wedge of wildcard weapons to beat. So let's target London (end July) with Las Vegas as the standby, and Dubai as the kick return.
He has multiple North American 70.3s to choose from in the next 7 weeks so that's not a determining factor. But IMs?
If only one then IMLP is the obvious choice (21 July) but that would mean shelving London as a 'top finish' target.
Frankfurt on 18 August is another, but likely the winner there will be further ahead, and 'every second counts'. And he doesn't travel well. Doesn't clash with anything, though.
The numbers (tl;dr probably not worth it):
A set of five scores, including one good (for him) IM raises the IM Pro Series potential score to 14,500 which will be top 10 (my estimate) and remember #8 only pays $20k.
But an athlete who places average #20 when completing two IMs plus Kona (30 minutes down in all three) plus a couple of 70.3s (15 minutes down x 2), scores 13,800.
The max possible score (Ryf 2018 dominance) is 21,500. We might expect Lange to score about 19,000 points (now on 6519, +4800 (Frankfurt), +1900 (10 mins down in a second 70.3), +5800 (Kona)) and not go to Taupo (he has no slot nor likely to get). Who else, as a benchmark for whether it's worth Long trying to score 5 times?
We might expect Mignon to score over 18,000 points (now on 4641, +4400 (Frankfurt), +4000 (two 70.3s), +5400 (Kona)) and not go to Taupo.
I assume Blummenfelt is going to validate his AQ for Taupo after Cagliari (guess a gentle training day @ Les Sables) so he with only four races could score 15,300 (2000+4700(Frankfurt)+5800(Kona)+2800(Taupo))
Of course the current IM Pro Series standings include only NA races (x 3) and the European contenders have IM Vitoria and IM Frankfurt to show their cards before Kona. So we have a skewed insight to the likely players.
I shall cross post this into another (non-event specific) thread.
Last edited by: Ajax Bay: May 5, 24 3:05
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [dcpinsonn] [ In reply to ]
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Appreciate the time to do a write up. Good stuff!!

Quick take #1. Burying Sam in the swim would be tough. He was ~3' down and won by over 7'. Nobody is going to put 10' on him. At this point, 70.3 distance, Sam would have to falter in order to get beat. I want to see him race this distance against Blu and Hayden Wilde. Throw Lionel in for grins and tickles.

http://www.sfuelsgolonger.com
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [timr] [ In reply to ]
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timr wrote:
Quick take #1. Burying Sam in the swim would be tough. He was ~3' down and won by over 7'. Nobody is going to put 10' on him. At this point, 70.3 distance, Sam would have to falter in order to get beat. I want to see him race this distance against Blu and Hayden Wilde. Throw Lionel in for grins and tickles.
Let's list a few others who might be others to catch:
Bergère
Stornes
Ditlev (not Taupo Q)
Keulen (not Taupo Q)
van Riel
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
Lurker4 wrote:


Great write up. In regards to your quick take 3 on the run, the run as definitely more difficult than 2022/23 years except for when we climbed up red cliffs in 2020/21.

This year we traded the flat section in town with a loop around the park for more climbing back out of town with a loop around the church. Significantly more climbing than last year, but Sam has said he loves the descents so it suited him well too.

StG is such a great race. I'm always surprised it doesn't sell out.

Just out of curiosity how much vertical did you have on the 2024 run in st. George vs 2023/2022?

Good question, here's a bunch for comparison. I flipped between strava data and device data to see if it was out of wack and it was consistent.

2024 half - 875 ft
2023 half - 784 ft
2022 half worlds - 757 ft *
2022 Full - 1594ft
2021 half - 1010ft
2021 half worlds - 1092ft

*this should be a little more gain than 2022 worlds though I'd think because we did a little climb near the golf course entrance
Last edited by: Lurker4: May 5, 24 7:08
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [Ajax Bay] [ In reply to ]
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Ajax Bay wrote:
devashish_paul wrote:
monty wrote:
My big question now is does sam start thinking about the Ironman series?? . . . I mean he probably cannot win the thing, but with one, maybe two fulls, well it could be possible to podium?? He could still get some good $$ for doing 5 half's at this level too, especially with a great worlds performance at the end. Has to be entering his mind I bet, so perhaps a full will suddenly appear on the horizon after a little break now for a good training bloc...
I chatted with Sam at Eric Wynn's ST get together BBQ in St. George. It "sounds" like Sam may be contemplating a full IM this summer some time. He mentioned Penticton being an option
Penticton isn't a Series race, however lovely and a living/surviving legend (and I appreciate the reason you might float that).
I'd be surprised if he chose to race an IM just 'for fun': to be meaningful surely he would want to race a stacked field? And racing anywhere except an IM Pro Series race will be a 'B' field (racing one would take prize money from the the neo-pros who need it).
Long's two top 70.3s plus 2700+ points at Taupo means he could rack up 12000 points with two more 70.3s.
With his contracted T100 events, whilst he needs to race 3 more times, plus GF, he only needs one more podium in the regular season races. That determines when he might slot in an IM (or heaven help us two IMs) or two more 70.3s, or one of each.
So which T100 offers his best chance of good points? Probably not SF with its swim and climbing, and van Riel there btw.
London looks good with Ibiza a possible, but with an enhanced level of post Olympic competition. Las Vegas will lose all the Kona bound athletes but that'll mean a wedge of wildcard weapons to beat. So let's target London (end July) with Las Vegas as the standby, and Dubai as the kick return.
He has multiple North American 70.3s to choose from in the next 7 weeks so that's not a determining factor. But IMs?
If only one then IMLP is the obvious choice (21 July) but that would mean shelving London as a 'top finish' target.
Frankfurt on 18 August is another, but likely the winner there will be further ahead, and 'every second counts'. And he doesn't travel well. Doesn't clash with anything, though.
The numbers (tl;dr probably not worth it):
A set of five scores, including one good (for him) IM raises the IM Pro Series potential score to 14,500 which will be top 10 (my estimate) and remember #8 only pays $20k.
But an athlete who places average #20 when completing two IMs plus Kona (30 minutes down in all three) plus a couple of 70.3s (15 minutes down x 2), scores 13,800.
The max possible score (Ryf 2018 dominance) is 21,500. We might expect Lange to score about 19,000 points (now on 6519, +4800 (Frankfurt), +1900 (10 mins down in a second 70.3), +5800 (Kona)) and not go to Taupo (he has no slot nor likely to get). Who else, as a benchmark for whether it's worth Long trying to score 5 times?
We might expect Mignon to score over 18,000 points (now on 4641, +4400 (Frankfurt), +4000 (two 70.3s), +5400 (Kona)) and not go to Taupo.
I assume Blummenfelt is going to validate his AQ for Taupo after Cagliari (guess a gentle training day @ Les Sables) so he with only four races could score 15,300 (2000+4700(Frankfurt)+5800(Kona)+2800(Taupo))
Of course the current IM Pro Series standings include only NA races (x 3) and the European contenders have IM Vitoria and IM Frankfurt to show their cards before Kona. So we have a skewed insight to the likely players.
I shall cross post this into another (non-event specific) thread.

London would be the perfect choice. Easy swim, flat bike, nothing wild on the run either.
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [timr] [ In reply to ]
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timr wrote:
He was ~3' down and won by over 7'. Nobody is going to put 10' on him. At this point, 70.3 distance, Sam would have to falter in order to get beat.

70.3 distance on a hilly course with a categorized climb. Put Sam on your run of the mill Ironman 70.3 course and suddenly he’s no longer gobbling people up like pacman - 360 watts or not. Those trains are high speed rail nowadays.

"FTP is a bit 2015, don't you think?" - Gustav Iden
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Re: Ironman Pro Series 70.3 St. George [kajet] [ In reply to ]
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kajet wrote:
timr wrote:
He was ~3' down and won by over 7'. Nobody is going to put 10' on him. At this point, 70.3 distance, Sam would have to falter in order to get beat.
70.3 distance on a hilly course with a categorized climb. Put Sam on your run of the mill Ironman 70.3 course and suddenly he’s no longer gobbling people up like pacman - 360 watts or not. Those trains are high speed rail nowadays.
Think Taupo bike is not "the run o' t' mill 70.3 bike course" with its ?800+m of climbing (cf St George at ~960m).
https://ridewithgps.com/routes/46519795
Nevertheless all those climbs (up Broadlands, both ways, both laps) are 'settle in' ones at 15m gaps for the main train well up the road. However, compared with what seen so far, the contenders in mid December all have better runs than Long.
Last edited by: Ajax Bay: May 5, 24 9:19
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