I agree with your point, but you are exaggerating by almost and order of magnitude.

I think the latter. A rising tide lifts all boats. It would be a pretty boring channel if it was just a coach and no athletes. Keeping a high profile for him will drive his actual business of selling training plans to people for $100 each. Not to mention the continued Youtube revenue. I'd imagine the pros on the squad could be invited with no cash transfer. It's a good deal for both parties.

Most likely, like Mark Allen, he'll get pulled into one of the bigger coaching programs that sees Sanders as a legitimate threat to their existing business, and recognizes that if they pay him an obscene amount of money they not only won't lose customers, they'll increase awareness and acquire new ones.

That's the smart move. He doesn't have to create anything.

The downside, is he'll own nothing and just get a paycheck for 5-10 years tops until his name fades into memory.

If he's smart, he'll make the deal in a way that acquires some degree of ownership in the platform. Otherwise, we'll be watching another youtube stream of consciousness video about how much he's learned, "about the business side of coaching"...

I would guess the money they want to pay him and the value that LS is are going. to be no where close, so it's a no brainer, control the brand if you are LS. No need to join forces with some coaching program.

Just do it yourself, and have full control....He can most certainly do it, he's that powerful of a brand in the sport. If this were any less of a "brand" I'd agree, but I think if your LS- create everything yourself. It's not that complicated, he'll pay a bunch of asst coaches to do the actual planning, while he sends a weekly text email telling the athlete who awesome their training is going.

So no way would I suggest going in with another coaching program. (why give up control or power of as powerful of a brand as LS is in the sport)

**Generally** AG athletes don't really have a clue if you are getting good coaching or not. Obviously higher level athletes can sniff out good or bad coaching, but many AG athletes have no clue if a coach is good or not.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Gutted you didn't include Colin Chartier in your examples of "athletes whose media presence skyrocketed after just training with the guy."

The more I think about it the more I think you're probably right.

Lol. Technically correct is the best kind of correct.

Bob tries so hard to give Lionel credit for past performances but Lionel is just his own worst enemy and over-analyzes everything.
The underlying current is that Lionel is now looking at retirement.

It's still baffles me that he has never worked with a sport psychologist (maybe he has, who knows).

He may be a powerful "brand" now but as another poster pointed out, he is going to be forgotten within 5-10 yrs after he retires. It's not like he's Mark Allen or Dave Scott, both of whom will have name recognition forever. :)

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

FWIW I don’t think mark and Dave have much name recognition outside of maybe the top 15-20% of enthusiast athletes in the sport. There’s no way more than 5% or athletes know who Lionel is and that number would be less than 1% with a year or two of his retiring.

Although I think a big percent of that number would also be chomping at the bit to be ‘coached’ by Lionel so it could be a good business venture for him.

For 5-10 yrs sure but, assuming retirement at age 40, he could be out of business by age 50. I like the fact that you think (as I do) that 15-20% of tri-geeks know who Mark and Dave are vs only 5% for Lionel.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Just watched bwb and Lionel sanders is saying everything that slowtwitch posts have said about him. That they report as trolling.

He sounds exactly like a slowtwitch thread.

I need to work on the swim, Magnus go it why can’t I.

I need to get a better bike position I am giving up 20 -45 watts.

I need stay focused all winter with jerry on swimming and commit.

These compress socks save 30 seconds for guys so they are doing the extras.

Bob said a lot of things maybe Lionel needed to hear but also at the end he tried to politely tell Lionel you are better suited for Ironman then 70.3 but I don’t think Lionel caught on.

I think Ironman is a mental race more then physical compared to other triathlons and he is just done in the mental hurt locker.


Lionel had to really hurt to win and he showed it , you can only suffer for so long, kids accelerate this time to slow down.

once you realize risk of healthy long term and your need to support others long term the mental support to let the body suffer goes away.

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Technique will always last longer then energy production. Improve biomechanics, improve performance.
http://Www.anthonytoth.ca, triathletetoth@twitter

Your talking about as an athlete, so if your suggesting he's got a 5-10 year window to build up a coaching brand, what is the issue? Because if you build up a great coaching brand, and people see people using the LS branded tri kits in races, he can easily be successful by then to build a sustainable brand. So if you can have the resources to make quarterly training camps work, that's how you keep the "LS" persona alive. So yes I agree that at some point a new generation of people will not know who LS is, but if the brand continues to grow as an AG coaching group, then you'll see it at races and people will want to be a part of it. So he can transition to a successful coaching brand and people not even know he was a world class athlete.

So again take advantage and own all the content if you are LS imo. He'll have plenty of years to then build up his coaching brand so that even if LS the pro youtuber is unknown, a new generation will just know LS as a coach. And again for the most part, AG coaching is pretty "hard" to fuck up. And most AG athletes don't really know the difference in good and bad coaching. Or at min they are usually long term invested atleast a year of training under a coach before they want to move on. The higher caliber athletes can easily sniff out the good and bad coaches. But the guy 2 races into his career and wants to hire a coach to do his 70.3 in 10 months, that guy has no clue what he wants or needs in a coach.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Yeah, unbelievable moments of clarity by Lionel in this video. Aero testing with Canyon, three bike positions for his last three races, lack of professionalism, etc. I love the guy but he's his own worst enemy.

So for me this sounds great, but it all falls flat when I see what Macca and Crowe have done. They were some of the best in the world at the time and both attempted to do just that. For what I can tell it fell flat. Maybe they have bigger followings in their home countries but it just seems like no one even remembers them and maccax/sansego don’t really seem to be that big.

Maybe they had more of a bank account saved up they didn’t need it as much and that’s part of why it fell flat. You probably have more insight into this than I. But they both seem like people that would listen to advisors and follow advice for more than a couple months. They retired and it was certainly less than 5-10 years before they were virtual nobodies in the sport so when I hear people say LS will be relevant in triathlon for 5-10 years it’s tough for me to imagine when he’s barely scratching that now and he’s still racing.

Well Macca is CEO and Co-founder of MANA sports which encompasses super league and cycling team Bahrain victorious. Not a bad post race career and certainly not short of a bob or two. Craig Alexander runs Sansego triathlon club which is uber successful and has him head up lots of coaching and age groupers/pro's. He also brokers lots of sponsorship deals and manages the affairs of a few well known professional triathletes - so not such a bad post race career either.

I think Lionel could do any of those things, or something with a different spin no problem.

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He who understands the WHY, will understand the HOW.

if you look more at other ex top pro triathletes, you can find examples of success with this approach.

Well, maybe, but we'll see if ST is talking about the "LS coaching machine" in about 13-14 years, if we are both still on ST ourselves.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

When lurker mentioned the way to go for an ex athlete is to go in with an already established coaching brand, imo a guy like Crowie would go down that path. IMO Crowie didn't have the personality to build a brand of followers to then take advantage of that. Crowie simply kicked everyone's ass for 10+ years at a high level, but other than that, he didn't really do much in order to build his "brand" ( for taking advantage post career within the biz side of the sport). So that only matters when you are trying to capitalize on your own business, which imo is what LS could do, while Crowie never could without a much bigger help/support system. LS could absolutely go at it alone and keep everything in house and be successful. There is a small number of athletes turned business that could do that imo in triathlon.

Macca has basically taken his personality and been able to become the face/leader of one of the biggest developments in the sport- SLT.

So I think comparing LS and Crowie is very poor example and missing the point of how/why LS will likely be successful. Simply being a top athlete doesn't mean you'll be successful within the biz side of the sport, most especially if you are considered sorta of an "boring" personality. So LS has been able to mesh his personalities with world class results and that's why if you give him a 5 year window, I don't see how he's not able to build that into a successful biz regardless of what he does.


Being in the coaching biz now for 15+ years, I remember one of the most important lessons in coaching.


You can be a world class coach but if you can't get athletes, it doesn't matter. You can be a “shit” coach but if you connect or know how to get athletes it really doesn’t matter.

So connecting with people is likely the biggest factor in the business side of the sport, so if you are telling me LS can use his connections with the fans in his next adventure.....yeah that's going to be sucessful.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

I have read some funny things here but the whole...

"Maybe they have bigger followings in their home countries but it just seems like no one even remembers them " and the classic " They retired and it was certainly less than 5-10 years before they were virtual nobodies in the sport"

......is just bloody hilarious. Macca is one of the most influential characters in the sport worldwide.

So this
MX Endurance · A Global endurance network, right at your fingertips
Has recently been rebranded to this
PHO3NIX CLUB · MX Endurance
But lets not forget the team
About - Bahrain Victorious 13
Which,during one long team lunch spawned this
Sub7Sub8 - Pho3nix Foundation
Which actually was part of this
Home - Pho3nix Foundation
Not to be one to be lazy though,he started this.
Chris McCormack: Taking on Sport as Business – Mana Group (manaseg.com)
Because this wasn't keeping him busy enough
Super League Triathlon | The World's Fastest Triathlon Series

Yep....A virtual nobody in the sport for sure....Hahaha...Slowtwitch delivers again.

Anyone watch the aero test video before it was delisted? Did they reveal too much.

I don’t think so. CDA from initial tests was around 2.3 and they got it down in the last few runs to under 2. It’s seemed like there was a couple of glitches in the YouTube playback so maybe because if that.

There were quite a few video editing errors in it so they will probably reupload it soon. It froze or gad static images foe 10 sec a few times.

Anywya he got it from 2.35 to 1.98 if my memory serves correct .

But damn Lionel needs someone to keep him in check, he seems almost manic at times, just rambling on. Maybe just the contrast of a very extrovert and very introvert in video format. Anyway content was cool and the new canyon is way faster. Now windtunnel time!

Imperial CdA figures argh. Should we start talking is hp saved? Anyways, that is huge, borderline ridiculous. Hope that's enough for him to get it now and understand power is only useful when it translates to speed.